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Crude Oil Price Skyrockets to New High!

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Crude Oil Price Skyrockets to New High!

Unread postby Daniel_Plainview » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 17:32:07

Crude Oil Rises to 25-Month High in New York as Dollar Tumbles
By Margot Habiby and Mark Shenk
Dec. 3 (Bloomberg) -- Crude oil rose to the highest level in 25 months as the dollar tumbled, boosting the appeal of commodities as an alternative investment.

Oil jumped 1.4 percent as the Dollar Index dropped to the lowest level since Nov. 23 after U.S. employers added fewer jobs than forecast in November. The unemployment rate unexpectedly increased. Futures for delivery from 2013 through 2018 fell below the current month’s price.

“The rally is due to a much lower dollar,” said Hamza Khan, an analyst with Schork Group Inc., a consulting company in Villanova, Pennsylvania. “This is not based on fundamentals.”

Oil for January delivery rose $1.19 to settle at $89.19 a barrel on the New York Mercantile Exchange, the highest closing price since Oct. 7, 2008. Futures increased 6.5 percent this week and 12 percent this year.

Oil futures for delivery in March 2012 fell as nearer-term contracts rallied, a sign that participants are reducing bets on the steepness of a price increase in the next few years. The long-term contracts moved into a market structure known as backwardation.

“The movement has been at work for a while, and it is what you expect when the fundamentals are tightening,” said Costanza Jacazio, a commodities analyst at Barclays Capital in New York. “From the end of September we’ve seen a major rebalancing. The trend has changed.”

Dollar Index

The Dollar Index, which tracks the currency against six others, dropped 1.1 percent, the most since Oct. 20 as of 2:38 p.m. in New York. The U.S. currency fell 1.2 percent to $1.3371 per euro, compared with $1.3209 yesterday.

The Thomson Reuters/Jefferies CRB Index of 19 commodities advanced 1.3 percent to 316.16, the strongest level since Nov. 10. Fifteen of the commodities increased.

“The rally continues, with $90 now in our sights,” said Gene McGillian, an analyst and broker at Tradition Energy in Stamford, Connecticut. “We shrugged off the unemployment numbers because of the way the dollar reacted to it.”

U.S. payrolls increased 39,000, less than the most pessimistic projection of economists surveyed by Bloomberg News, according to Labor Department figures released today in Washington, a signal fuel demand may be slow to rebound. The jobless rate rose to 9.8 percent, the most since April, Labor Department figures showed today.

Fuel Consumption

U.S. fuel consumption decreased 1.8 percent in the week ended Nov. 26 to 18.5 million barrels a day, the lowest level since the seven days ended Oct. 15, an Energy Department report showed this week. It was the third weekly decline.

“When the market doesn’t sell off on bearish news, it shows that there’s some sort of internal strength there,’ said Matt Smith, a commodities analyst for Summit Energy in Louisville, Kentucky.

The Institute for Supply Management’s non-manufacturing index, which covers about 90 percent of the economy, rose to 55 in November from 54.3 a month earlier. A reading higher than 50 signals growth.

Crude oil extended gains, touching $89.33 a barrel in intraday trading after breaking technical support at $88.63, the high from Nov. 11.

“Some of this is just ongoing bullish market sentiment that was only briefly influenced by the employment report,” said Tim Evans, an energy analyst at Citi Futures Perspective in New York. “The softer U.S. dollar is a focus, although that has been a real argument of convenience. We’re not applying it in any sort of consistent way.”

$120 Oil

Oil will advance to $120 a barrel before the end of 2012 as consumption grows in emerging economies, according to a report today from JPMorgan Chase & Co.

Crude futures in New York will average $93 a barrel next year, up from a previous estimate of $89.75, and Brent crude traded in London will average $95 a barrel, compared with an earlier assessment of $91.75, the bank’s analysts forecast.

“Strong emerging oil demand growth over the next 24 months is very likely to lift the call on OPEC production to levels last seen at the peak of the oil price spike in 2008,” analysts led by Lawrence Eagles in New York said.

The Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries, which is responsible for about 40 percent of global supplies, is unlikely to increase production in the first half of next year unless prices surge through $100 a barrel, the analysts said. OPEC oil ministers meet Dec. 11 in Quito, Ecuador.

Brent crude for January settlement on the ICE Futures Europe exchange in London gained 73 cents, or 0.8 percent, to $91.42 a barrel. Earlier, it reached a two-year high of $91.85 a barrel.

Oil volume in electronic trading on the Nymex was 756,029 contracts as of 2:42 p.m. in New York. Volume totaled 712,492 contracts yesterday, 2.7 percent above the average of the past three months. Open interest was 1.37 million contracts.


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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby pstarr » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 17:54:51

Daniel_Plainview wrote:Oil futures for delivery in March 2012 fell as nearer-term contracts rallied, a sign that participants are reducing bets on the steepness of a price increase in the next few years. The long-term contracts moved into a market structure known as backwardation.
ie there is not enough oil today, when we need it now. This price rise has nothing to do with speculation. It is all about PO.
Our great-great-grandparents burned wood and coal. Our grandparents burned oil. We burn natural gas. Our children will burn their furniture. :badgrin:
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby vision-master » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 18:03:43

Time for T1?

“So the only Transition we can see rather clearly (or rather, we hope to be able to comprehend) is T1. It is clear that T1 will witness the tilting of the ‘Oil Demand’ and ‘Oil Supply’ scales — with the former dominant at the onset and the latter commanding toward the close (say, by 2009 or 2010).

“But even during that rather benign T1, the unexpected might become the rule and the orderly ‘Pre-Peak’ rapidly give way to some chaotic ‘Post-Peak.’


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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Xenophobe » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 18:14:54



Seems reasonable to me. Not as good as tacking on a decent $50/bbl import tax and getting some decent demand destruction without having to go through this currency business. I suppose its politically unpalatable to do it directly, so the government is letting the Fed do it for them.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby eXpat » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 18:40:25

OPEC said already some time ago, that they want the price to go to $100.
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
George Bernard Shaw

You can ignore reality, but you can't ignore the consequences of ignoring reality.” Ayn Rand
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby pstarr » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 18:41:44

Xenophobe wrote:Not as good as a decent $50/bbl import tax

Huh? You are kidding correct? Otherwise this is quite a shock given your Republican inclinations. I have yet to see a global-warming ignorer, evolution-denying, peak-oil debunking Ayn Randian consider an "import tax" a good thing. It doesn't even make sense from a Keynesian point of view :shock:

Shorty! Have you lost your mind??????? Right. It never existed in the first place. :razz:
Our great-great-grandparents burned wood and coal. Our grandparents burned oil. We burn natural gas. Our children will burn their furniture. :badgrin:
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Xenophobe » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 18:49:19

eXpat wrote:OPEC said already some time ago, that they want the price to go to $100.


Sounds reasonable. I think the $150 marker is better.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Xenophobe » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 19:01:52

pstarr wrote:
Xenophobe wrote:Not as good as a decent $50/bbl import tax

Huh? You are kidding correct? Otherwise this is quite a shock given your Republican inclinations.


Its only a shock to those who manufacture their view of the world from cliff notes. Written in Swahili. By a Japanese special needs student. Who was high at the time.

The quality of understanding a thing is often affected by one's ability to learn. Your confusion at not understanding the world, or the people in it, is expected.

I think the only way that we can get a decent start on driving a stake through the heart of this American crude crack hoe habit is to make it more expensive, WAY more expensive. The sooner the better. I say then you take half the money coming in from the tax and plow it into subsidies for EV's, extended range EV's, hybrids, diesels, fuel cells, public transport construction, you name it.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby pstarr » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 19:25:31

Xenophobe wrote:
pstarr wrote:
Xenophobe wrote:Not as good as a decent $50/bbl import tax

Huh? You are kidding correct? Otherwise this is quite a shock given your Republican inclinations.
I think the only way that we can get a decent start on driving a stake through the heart of this American crude crack hoe habit is to make it more expensive, WAY more expensive. The sooner the better. I say then you take half the money coming in from the tax and plow it into subsidies for EV's, extended range EV's, hybrids, diesels, fuel cells, public transport construction, you name it.
You are a DUMB tax-and-spend liberal then?

Ready to dump money into questionable technologies? No EV has ever EVER succeeded in the American auto market (Well. Not since before Henry Ford) because of intrinsic limitations (battery charge time and exorbitant cost, short vehicle range, lack of support infrastructure, etc.) and yet you are ready to CRUSH the economy with a regressive tax on the poorest members of society ($50/barrel? Whooeeeee :shock: ) in the name of what? An imaginary economic bubble?

Shorty, do you know what is especially revealing in this discussion? You are ready to blame high oil prices on a American crude crack hoe habit . That suggests that exorbitant demand is a problem. If it weren't for peak oil then exorbitant supply would render the issue academic.

Let's see you wiggle out of this dilemma. Dance byoch :twisted:
Our great-great-grandparents burned wood and coal. Our grandparents burned oil. We burn natural gas. Our children will burn their furniture. :badgrin:
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Xenophobe » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 19:43:04

pstarr wrote:Ready to dump money into questionable technologies?


Only a high, special needs Japanese student trying to learn Swahili would think that something is questionable when its parked in my garage. Took me to work this morning. Not a thing questionable about it.

pstarr wrote: You are ready to blame high oil prices on a American crude crack hoe habit . That suggests that exorbitant demand is a problem.
Let's see you wiggle out of this dilemma. Dance byoch :twisted:


Do you have a memory disorder? We've discussed this before, I agree with Hirsch on the topic of exorbitant demand, his estimate being that 67% of car and 50% of plane travel is discretionary.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby pstarr » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 19:48:28

You lost. You said Hirsch.

The Hirsch Report wrote:“This problem is truly frightening. This problem is like nothing that I have ever seen in my lifetime, and the more you think about it and the more you look at the numbers, the more uneasy any observer gets. It's so easy to sound alarmist, and I fear that part of what I'm saying may sound alarmist, but there simply is no question that the risks here are beyond anything that any of us have ever dealt with. And the risks to our economies and our civilization are enormous.”
Our great-great-grandparents burned wood and coal. Our grandparents burned oil. We burn natural gas. Our children will burn their furniture. :badgrin:
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Xenophobe » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 20:27:28

pstarr wrote:You lost. You said Hirsch.


I did say Hirsch. But certainly not your quote trying to distract from the point of massive discretionary use of crude in America.

"In the short run, much of the burden of adjustment will likely be borne by decreases in
consumption from discretionary decisions, since 67 percent of personal
automobile travel and nearly 50 percent of airplane travel are discretionary."

And yet another crude ad hom deleted...
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby pstarr » Fri 03 Dec 2010, 20:44:34

You shorty, are a LWM (Last Word Moron) :lol:
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby OilFinder2 » Sat 04 Dec 2010, 21:10:20

The last time oil was in backwardation was in mid-2008.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby OilFinder2 » Sat 04 Dec 2010, 21:17:18

Interesting write-up. Almost 2 years old, but nonetheless ...

LINK
Backwardation means that forward contracts are priced lower than nearer term contracts, or spot, and when it occurs it is a sign of price deflation to come. As an example, suppose you could buy gold today (Dec. 8, 2008) for $700/oz, and suppose the June 2009 contract were priced at $690/oz. That means gold today is worth more than what the futures market says it is going to be worth in the future. This sort of condition typically happens due to momentary supply shortages in a spot market for “soft” commodities, especially natural gas or oil.

When the 2005 hurricanes slammed the Gulf Coast, there was huge backwardation in the natural gas market, and for good reason. People who really needed natural gas supplies right now were willing to pay up for it in light of the shortages caused by the hurricane. But the futures markets did not believe that such supply shortages were going to be long-lasting, and priced forward contracts more appropriately in expectation of a return to normalcy.

[...]

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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby OilFinder2 » Sat 04 Dec 2010, 21:31:26

Here's the Comex futures for CL:
http://www.cmegroup.com/trading/energy/ ... crude.html
^
Notice that futures prices for 2014-early 2016 are priced $1-$2 *lower* than the price of the current contract. If traders were anticipating increasing shortages then, the price of those future contracts would be higher than the current price, not lower.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby OilFinder2 » Sat 04 Dec 2010, 21:40:13

pstarr wrote:
Daniel_Plainview wrote:Oil futures for delivery in March 2012 fell as nearer-term contracts rallied, a sign that participants are reducing bets on the steepness of a price increase in the next few years. The long-term contracts moved into a market structure known as backwardation.
ie there is not enough oil today, when we need it now. This price rise has nothing to do with speculation. It is all about PO.

You didn't read your own excerpt carefully enough. Read the part I've highlighted in red. If traders were anticipating increasing shortages of oil due to PO (or any other reason), they would not be "reducing bets on the steepness of a price increase in the next few years." Instead, they would be bidding up contracts for futures dates such as March 2012, not bidding them down.
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 04 Dec 2010, 23:11:33

OilFinder2 wrote:Here's the Comex futures for CL:
http://www.cmegroup.com/trading/energy/ ... crude.html
^
Notice that futures prices for 2014-early 2016 are priced $1-$2 *lower* than the price of the current contract. If traders were anticipating increasing shortages then, the price of those future contracts would be higher than the current price, not lower.


Note that early 2014-2016 is 3+ to 5+ years from now. If the global economy is picking up now (seems a very mixed bag to me -- emerging markets strongly yes, Europe mixed and risky due to debt issues, USA mixed (unemployment and housing down, many other major indicators up)) -- that would seem to mean higher oil prices in the near term, which is what has been happening lately.

I don't know. I'm a fundamental investor, not a chart reader. Many pundits I see lately on CNBC keep seeing its move to backwardation is a STRONGLY bullish sign for crude, as it implies insufficient supply in the near term is expected.

Just using common sense, and forgetting the charts for the moment, if you think we are in a US and generally global economic recovery (as you seem to have been making a decent case for, against many adversaries on this site), wouldn't that fundamentally point toward higher crude oil prices in the next year or two?

Longer term, who can say?

1). Technology can change.
2).The global economy can change.
3). Maybe the first world can reduce their demand quicker than 3rd world demand can increase.
4). Maybe pigs will learn to fly.

(I believe number 3 as much as number 4, for the next decade or so).

You make a lot of sharp calls based on MSM economic statistics. Do you really want to make this call on a 2ish percent backwardation in 3 to 5(+) years? (Just curious).
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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby OilFinder2 » Sat 04 Dec 2010, 23:53:21

Many pundits I see lately on CNBC keep seeing its move to backwardation is a STRONGLY bullish sign for crude, as it implies insufficient supply in the near term is expected.

As you can see from the chart I posted on the previous page, yes, backwardation - when it first starts - can be a sign of shorter-term price increases, but then a correction later. And the backwardation can go on for a while before the correction arrives. Notice that, although it can be bullish, it does not necessarily indicate a sharp price spike - for instance in the backwardation from about 2000 to late 2001 the price looks like it rose from around $15 to around $30. You could translate that as either a large rise of about 50% or a more modest rise (by today's standards) of $15. You had a brief contango in late 2001 followed by another lengthy backwardation. Interestingly, the size of the spread of the peak of the backwardation in 2003 was larger than the one in 2007-08 but resulted in a much smaller price rise. Also, the resulting price correction (in 2006-07) took a while to occur after the backwardation went into contango. So I think the most you can say is, assuming the current backwardation lasts for more than a very short period, it means the price will rise short term and then correct itself, but it is impossible to say how long "short term" is, and what will be the size of the price increase and ensuing correction.

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Re: Oil Skyrockets to 25-Month High of Nearly $90/bbl

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sun 05 Dec 2010, 02:42:09

OilFinder2 wrote: So I think the most you can say is, assuming the current backwardation lasts for more than a very short period, it means the price will rise short term and then correct itself, but it is impossible to say how long "short term" is, and what will be the size of the price increase and ensuing correction.

In that context, what you're saying makes a lot of sense to me, and I tend to agree with the overall thesis. I suspect there are just SO many variables that trying to predict what short term is or the magnitude of the increase and correction is just a fool's errand (as you implied) which is why I don't tend to focus on wiggles on charts, use stop losses, etc. -- dealing with all the false signals in any technically based trading system has LOTS of costs over time,

Thanks much for the detailed response!
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