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THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Discussions of conventional and alternative energy production technologies.

Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby ROCKMAN » Sun 27 Aug 2017, 14:20:45

"...but the same metric does not hold true in China, India, Turkey or most of the rest of the world..."

Not exactly sure what that means. But the US produces more electricity from coal then any other country except China. And twice as much as #3 India. And Turkey? Not even in the top 10. And #10, England? The US produces more then 10X the amount of electricity from coal as England.

No, the US isn't "the world". But noting that the US is one of the largest producers and consumers of coal on the plant as well as a leading electricity generator from coal is not f*cking "parochial" by any measure.

Anyone can try to pretend it is not true but by any measure China and the US are King Coal and Queen Coal. LOL. So it isn't just President Trump telling the Paris Accord to go f*ck itself: so did the collective citizens of the USA. Including President Obama and all the D's in Congress: their words may have represented otherwise but their actions did not.
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby GHung » Mon 08 Jan 2018, 18:56:22

Federal regulator rejects Trump coal rescue plan

Federal regulators have rejected a controversial Trump administration proposal that would have propped up slumping coal companies.

The Federal Energy Regulatory Commission dismissed Energy Secretary Rick Perry's call to subsidize power plants like coal and nuclear that maintain a 90-day supply of fuel on site. Perry cited a need to improve the resilience of the nation's power grid, especially from severe weather.

The proposal, which was supported by coal mining companies like Murray Energy, was widely seen as an attempt to help the coal and nuclear industry. Coal, in particular, has been crushed in recent years by the rise of cleaner energy like natural gas and solar and by tougher environmental regulation.

In a blow to Trump's campaign promise to help coal country, FERC on Monday terminated a rulemaking process that Perry had launched.

The independent agency, which is run by bipartisan commissioners appointed by the president and confirmed by the Senate, faced a Wednesday deadline to rule on the matter.

FERC did decide to take steps to evaluate the resilience of the power system. It directed regional transmission organizations and independent system operators, which move electricity through the grid, to submit information. FERC said it expects to "promptly decide whether additional Commission action is warranted to address grid resilience." ......

.......The Energy Department said the rule was needed to "address the crisis at hand" regarding the resilience of the electric grid. The department cited the 2014 extreme cold snap known as the Polar Vortex as well as natural disasters such as Hurricanes Sandy, Harvey and Irma.

However, some analysts pointed out that power outages are usually caused by downed power lines, not a short supply of fuel. Less than 0.1% of all electricity disturbances over the last five years were caused by fuel supply emergencies, according to a report by the Rhodium Group, a research firm. .....
http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/08/investi ... index.html
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Mon 08 Jan 2018, 19:22:07

GHung wrote:
Federal regulator rejects Trump coal rescue plan

Federal regulators have rejected a controversial Trump administration proposal that would have propped up slumping coal companies.

The Federal Energy Regulatory Commission dismissed Energy Secretary Rick Perry's call to subsidize power plants like coal and nuclear that maintain a 90-day supply of fuel on site. Perry cited a need to improve the resilience of the nation's power grid, especially from severe weather.

The proposal, which was supported by coal mining companies like Murray Energy, was widely seen as an attempt to help the coal and nuclear industry. Coal, in particular, has been crushed in recent years by the rise of cleaner energy like natural gas and solar and by tougher environmental regulation.

In a blow to Trump's campaign promise to help coal country, FERC on Monday terminated a rulemaking process that Perry had launched.

The independent agency, which is run by bipartisan commissioners appointed by the president and confirmed by the Senate, faced a Wednesday deadline to rule on the matter.

FERC did decide to take steps to evaluate the resilience of the power system. It directed regional transmission organizations and independent system operators, which move electricity through the grid, to submit information. FERC said it expects to "promptly decide whether additional Commission action is warranted to address grid resilience." ......

.......The Energy Department said the rule was needed to "address the crisis at hand" regarding the resilience of the electric grid. The department cited the 2014 extreme cold snap known as the Polar Vortex as well as natural disasters such as Hurricanes Sandy, Harvey and Irma.

However, some analysts pointed out that power outages are usually caused by downed power lines, not a short supply of fuel. Less than 0.1% of all electricity disturbances over the last five years were caused by fuel supply emergencies, according to a report by the Rhodium Group, a research firm. .....
http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/08/investi ... index.html

The spouses and children or those that voted against the Trump position on this issue should be very afraid. Within a year their principle bread winner will be out of work and blacklisted and they will be applying for welfare and might even be deigned that.
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby GoghGoner » Tue 09 Jan 2018, 06:36:30

Coal's global bust cycle ended a year ago. Even in the US more coal than NG has been burning this winter. Commodities (more or less) all follow the same general cycle.

Coal price near USD 100 seen gains after best year since 2012

Newcastle coal is forecast to average USD 84 a tonne this year as China extends a strategy started in 2016 to reduce domestic output and streamline its industry, according to UBS Group AG analyst Lachlan Shaw. Prices are trading near USD 100 after averaging about USD 87 last year, the most since 2012. Miners are benefiting from the surge, including Australian producer New Hope Corp., which capped its first annual increase in six years.
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby Subjectivist » Tue 09 Jan 2018, 09:16:23

There are 5 FERC commissioners yet the article doesn’t say either who voted which way or that the vote was unanimous. Really not much info but lots of opinion.
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby ROCKMAN » Wed 10 Jan 2018, 16:51:47

Sub - Here you go from Reuters:

"On Jan. 8, the five commissioners, four of them nominated by President Donald Trump, agreed unanimously to reject the proposed rule and instead opt for a further study of resilience issues."
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby Subjectivist » Wed 10 Jan 2018, 19:09:11

ROCKMAN wrote:Sub - Here you go from Reuters:

"On Jan. 8, the five commissioners, four of them nominated by President Donald Trump, agreed unanimously to reject the proposed rule and instead opt for a further study of resilience issues."


Thanx, I couldn’t find it.
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby ROCKMAN » Thu 11 Jan 2018, 16:47:42

Sub - Reuters is typically my first go-to. Interesting 4 were nominated by the POTUS. Guess he didn't run the "loyalty test" on them. LOL.
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Re: THE Coal Thread pt 3 (merged)

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Thu 11 Jan 2018, 17:28:37

The Boston Globe had an opinion piece today that discussed the recent cold snap and how coal and oil were making most of the power. I was reading a traditional hard copy so don't have a link to it that isn't pay walled. The author had figured out that NIMBY resistance to natural gas pipelines and off shore wind plus the closing of nuclear power plants had forced to power companies to turn to the traditional ,cheaper and dirtier supplies. The expression "letting the perfect be the enemy of the good" came up.
Worth a read if you have access. 8)
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