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THE Algae Thread (merged)

Discussions of conventional and alternative energy production technologies.

Re: Algae-based Biofuels Moving Ever So Slowly to Market

Unread postby Graeme » Mon 30 Jan 2012, 17:43:42

Micro-Bubbles Cut Cost of Algae-Derived Biofuel

Algae naturally produce oil. When it’s processed, that oil can be turned into biofuel, an alternative energy source. There’s just one snag—harvesting the oil from algae-filled water is prohibitively expensive. But researchers have come up with an effervescent solution: bubbles smaller than the width of a human hair can help reduce the costs of collecting algae oil.

So-called micro-bubbles are already used for water purification—they surround contaminants and float them out of the liquid. Similarly, in water containing algae, bubbles can float the algae to the surface for easy collection and processing.

The research builds on previous work that used micro-bubbles to grow algae more densely and thus increase production. This time, however, the researchers produced the fizziness with a new method that uses far less energy, and is cheaper to install. The study is in the journal Biotechnology and Bioengineering. [James Hanotu, HC Hemaka Bandulasena and William B Zimmerman, "Micro-Flotation Performance for Algal Separation"]


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All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby bcole » Fri 09 Mar 2012, 20:58:25

Anyone know why?
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Fri 09 Mar 2012, 21:42:27

So they can get sequestration plants running with their partners in energy the coal/ electric sector and metals processing. They have already got something like 30% capability to 'catch' carbon dioxide through high tech algae farming, but it is high tech/ big plant hooked up to a monster burner system of some sort. An extension of the zero sum gain at present, but quickly becoming a self funding area of alternative energy R& D which has to be good thing.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby PrestonSturges » Fri 09 Mar 2012, 23:45:52

Alga have unique lipid synthesis pathwys in the chloroplats, but they are not tightly coupled to photosynthesis. Alga can actually synthesize biodeisel using simple carbon sources like carbonate, in the dark. Sure there is competition from cyanobacteria etc
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby pstarr » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 00:01:54

billions? I find that very hard to believe. they are not idiots.
Yikes!
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby peakoilishere » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 01:07:36

Pstar, I wouldn't be surprised if it was billions. Exon has spent 300 million alone. Its sad though there throwing good money away after such a crappy idea. they really need to spend the money on developing energy resources like oil and natural gas.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby PrestonSturges » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 01:44:57

The military is investing in this. They don't want to be stranded on the side of the road in case of mid-east war.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 02:13:48

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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby pstarr » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 02:25:19

What an ugly unnecessary post. Could it have anything to do with your GW's foolish ethanol mandate?

Plant you really don't belong here anymore. I think you have outlasted your welcome.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby AdTheNad » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 06:49:57

pstarr wrote:billions? I find that very hard to believe. they are not idiots.

Maybe if you include the money they spend advertising their investments into algae and being green.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 07:27:11

Research into algae oil is what brought me to this web site in the first place. Work has been done on it going back to the Carter administration but low oil prices shoved it onto a back burner. Now that we are above $100 per barrel and rising algae oil is or soon will be viable. There is a lot of potential there. You can use dessert land which there is plenty of so your production does not have to compete with farmland producing human food. You can use sea water or brackish water unfit for other purposes. You can use human waste water as a fertilizer source while cleaning it at the same time and you can spur the growth of algae by bubbling CO2 through the water balancing other CO2 emissions.
It will never be a source of $2.50 gas but it may become cheaper then $8.00 gas pumped from the glowing hole that used to be Iran.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby AgentR11 » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 17:19:15

pstarr wrote:What an ugly unnecessary post. Could it have anything to do with your GW's foolish ethanol mandate?.


No where near as ugly as some of the posts here about Bush II during his reign.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 17:26:23

vtsnowedin wrote: Now that we are above $100 per barrel and rising algae oil is or soon will be viable. There is a lot of potential there.
...
It will never be a source of $2.50 gas but it may become cheaper then $8.00 gas pumped from the glowing hole that used to be Iran.

It seems to me that doing some research on potentially viable substitutes or alternatives for hydrocarbons is perfectly reasonable. How much should be spent and how soon -- well, that's what investment risk and the stock market is all about. I'm happy to see the likes of Exxon doing some research, and following up (rationally) based on how events unfold.

If we do nothing for a decade or three, things like Chindia and BAU growth will make $8.00 or higher gasoline a likely reality -- even IF the middle east manages not to become a post-war bombed out wasteland.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 17:43:02

It was the oil from algae thing got me reading a lot more in 07/08.

One point missed in this thread is the market developing in carbon trading. Green credits are going to be hard to come by. Tree planting projects, wind and solar farms, then any form of carbon recycling or sequestration. Whoever gets this up and running at scale stands to be able to: get free credit for continued development, sell their 'green oil', hype themselves as 'eco-friendly', AGW activists. The annual turnover in carbon credits will quickly go to trillion dollar plus amounts over the next few years if it gets up worldwide. It is already up in the EU, Australia and NZ are bringing it in, most of Asia is in wait and see mode, the USG has it's fingers in it's ears singing 'La la la!'. Every country is politicking and bargaining for a place at the table and a slice of this new pie. It should come as no surprise billions are being spent in anticipation of this emerging market.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 18:00:29

I am very dubious about all the carbon credit and carbon sequestration schemes.They may grow for awhile and millions or billions may get sucked up by shysters and wheeler dealers but I think in the end they will all be abandoned as not demonstrably effective or cost efficient.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Sat 10 Mar 2012, 18:24:07

I'm dubious on the long term benefit of the tech also, but I see collapse as likely to be partial, with all kinds of attempts at blowing bubbles meanwhile/ carbon credits being one of those schemes being designed by the globalists as a logical business strategy in a shaky global economy.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 11 Mar 2012, 02:37:58

Government support for algae fuel research goes back almost 30 years to the Reagan administration. The algae research program that Obama described in his state of the union speech was actually started by Reagan 30 years ago, was killed by Clinton 15 years ago, and now is being resurrected by the Obama administration.

Obama restarting Reagan-era project on algae fuel research


"The Reagan Administration and the national algal biofuels program

The vital pivot from hydrogen to transportation fuel as a product from algae was undertaken by the Reagan Administration, and was continued under the Bush Administration.

The program, in fact, was shut down under the stewardship of Secretary Hazel O’Leary, a Democrat serving under President Bill Clinton.....It goes back to why the algae R&D program was shut down. At the time, the researchers concluded that 1990s energy prices were too low by a third to support algal biofuels. That was in the days of $20 oil. They thought that oil would have to be at something astronomic, like $80 a barrel, for algal biofuels to make sense.

Times have changed. Oil hit $135 in 2008. Today, West Texas intermediate is at $106 a barrel. Miles above $80. That’s why the algal R&D was restarted. That’s why so many people are getting behind the technology."


Image

Starting and stopping and then restarting government backed research on things like algae gasoline is not a national energy plan. This kind of short-term perspective is why we need a real national energy policy with a real plan for the future, not just knee jerk responses by politicians that come and go in response to spikes in gasoline prices.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sun 11 Mar 2012, 10:24:16

8) The fact that the energy companies are now making their own investments in algae oil is a good sign. The money will be better spent then any government research grant and positive results much more likely. On the other hand this investment indicates that in spite of their public positions on Peak oil their actual opinion on the subject has come around to the position that substitutes will soon be needed and profitable.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby Sys1 » Sun 11 Mar 2012, 13:26:08

Algae technology is in the domain of Jaevon paradox. It is not a new energy but a way to improve the use of fossil fuels by using a part of wastes (CO2) currently produced to have more oil. By the way, be sure this "green" oil will be burnt and will in the end finish in the atmosphere.
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Re: All Big Oil has invested billions in "Algae"

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sun 11 Mar 2012, 16:57:26

Sys1 wrote:Algae technology is in the domain of Jaevon paradox. It is not a new energy but a way to improve the use of fossil fuels by using a part of wastes (CO2) currently produced to have more oil. By the way, be sure this "green" oil will be burnt and will in the end finish in the atmosphere.

Properly done algae oil is a conversion of solar energy through photosynthesis into a storable liquid fuel. Much more then just a conversion of fossil fuel energy or an efficiency gain. To be sure of this production farms would have to operate pumps etc. on PV, wind or hydro power so there would be no fossil fuel inputs into the final product.
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