Exploring Hydrocarbon Depletion
Subjectivist wrote:pstarr wrote:but we could never adapt, build enough dikes to prevent flooding of our cites and suburbs. The rising tides would always find a way through the small hole and ruin everything. (:
We have these things called moving trucks that can relocate you to Adenver where you will never have to worry about sea level rise again.
kiwichick wrote:@ pstarr.....yes the plants take in the CO2 faster .....and increased heat and evaporation forces them to close down so they don't die
'if the current warming trend continue' is a big IF . . . given that global greening has just commenced.kiwichick wrote:in this transition phase some species will exhibit gains .....just as some higher latitudes will also exhibit gains ....but areas where it is already hot/dry a point will be reached ....if the current warming trend continues....when the gains start to reverse
kiwichick wrote:Having been involved in agriculture for over 30 years it is very easy to see how fragile most agricultural systems actually are ......especially at the modern levels of production expected and required to keep 7 billion humans alive
kiwichick wrote:While nitrogen is a byproduct of the natural gas industry (largely ) , the other major elements ,,P, K, S, Ca, Mg ....are all essentially non renewable , even if they can ( could ) be recyclable
kiwichick wrote:Recycling is already happening
http://p-rex.eu/uploads/media/P-REX_Pol ... _final.pdf
kiwichick wrote:@ pstarr.....one response to increased levels of CO2 is to reduce stomata density
hence CO2 is only required in certain quantity's ; more CO2 won't result in more plant growth longterm because other elements will be the limiting factors ; including heat and water
ralfy wrote:The point to consider is not timing but extent of damage across several generations.
pstarr wrote:So runaway global warming might happen across generations? So it has not arrived, as per this thread. Anyone care to predict which generation?
Perhaps Tanada might starts pt 14, and you all can get back to the serious, immediate business of worrying about our soon-to-arrive DOOM!
onlooker wrote:Tanada wrote:Fast crash doomers be they peak resources, climate, social unrest, economy all suffer from the same short range vision problem. They always and forever predict DOOM is just around the corner and when DOOM fails to appear at anything like the scale they predicted they then try and cast any tragedy as being a much greater DOOM than it actually was. look back at the coverage of Katrina/New Orleans. Look back at the coverage of Mocando/Deep Water Horizon. Look back at the Japanese Tsunami/Fukushima. What they don't get is like the boys who cried wolf over and over and over when no mega scale doom happens people dismiss them as a bunch of cranks and they end up hurting the Peak oil and Peak Resources and Climate and pick your problem by preventing Joe6P from taking their solutions seriously.
To a certain degree you have a point Tanada, especially with regards to timing. However, I must dispute the call on the severity issue. While certainly some have predicted catastrophic things to have already have happened, others here on this site are pointing out the trajectory that points to Catastrophe at the end of the road. I cannot really speak for others, so I will speak about myself. In the economic/peak oil topic, I was not even around in the false alarm times of 2005 or so. I am now saying that the contributions of the Etp model are valuable and should be heeded and thus the conclusions those in that specialization have reached. As for climate and the rest of the environmental concerns, I have been pretty consistent in that I have pointed out repeatedly that we are in the process of degrading and dismantling our natural life support systems with the kind of activities we as modern humans engage in and because of our immense numbers. I am not sure about timing and I have never cited a date or dates. I have voiced a certain support for Cid Yama and his shocking conclusions based on reading his well referenced argument about the ESAS and the escape of the methane from that area as being potentially catastrophic. Well, that potential does seem nearer because of the anomalies we are now witnessing going on in the Arctic. So all in all while yes some boy crying wolf has occurred, the opposite in still more prevalent. That opposite being authorities and media not giving the true comprehensive account of the nature of our predicament and a populace meandering between ignorance, apathy and outright chosen denial.
Onlooker this meme is popular on Facebook these days and is the prime example of what I am talking about. Joe6P no longer finds Global Warming Alarmism credible, it has devolved into a subject worthy only of ridicule.
onlooker wrote:Yes, I will concede that some one like Guy Mcpherson is probably being more counterproductive than productive with his alarm that we will most likely become extinct by 2025 or something like that. I believe Cid has not stated that. He has said that the TSWHTF by approximately 2020 and from then on truly biblical proportion type catastrophes await and by around the end of the century that will probably be it for all of us. So, yes some predictions are not called for. I prefer simply to lay out the details and facts and let whomever reach their own conclusions as to severity and timing.
I haven't seen studies on this yet, but I'm seeing a lot more pictures like this of noctilucent clouds, clouds formed from ice particles in the stratosphere. Their supposed to be quite rare, since there generally is not much water vapor to form such crystals that far up in the atmosphere.
That we are seeing more pictures of them may be just a product of everyone having cameras. But I do wonder about this as evidence that Arctic methane had been getting up into the stratosphere. IIRC, that is the main mechanism for H2O formation at that altitude--the breakdown of methane and, I believe, ozone. But others can (and I'm sure will) correct me (and probably worse, but I guess that goes with the territory! ).
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