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Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

For discussions of events and conditions not necessarily related to Peak Oil.

Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Apneaman » Fri 20 Nov 2015, 22:09:15

PUT ANOTHER DENIER ON THE BAR-BE, MATE!



Record Heat Puts Australia at Risk of Intense Fire Season


http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/21/world ... .html?_r=0


Sydney melts in record heat


http://www.iol.co.za/news/world/sydney- ... k9ehb-7T6M
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Apneaman » Fri 20 Nov 2015, 22:15:06

HOW BAD IS THE DROUGHT IN ETHIOPIA?


"Alarm bells are ringing for a food emergency in Ethiopia. The UN says 15 million people will need help over the coming months. The government, wary of stigma and therefore hesitant to ask for help, has nevertheless said more than eight million Ethiopians need food assistance. Extra imports to stem the crisis are already pegged at more than a million tonnes of grain, beyond the government’s means. Inevitably, comment and media coverage compare the current situation with 1984 – the year Ethiopia’s notorious famine hit the headlines. Reports suggest this is the worst drought in 30 years. One declares it a “code red” drought. So how bad actually is it?"

http://newirin.irinnews.org/dataviz/201 ... n-ethiopia
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Apneaman » Fri 20 Nov 2015, 22:35:23

Funny how some of the wing nuts claims are partially true, but not in the way they had hoped. The models have been inaccurate - underestimated by quite a bit. Seems feedbacks are just too difficult/complex to model. Climate scientists are lying - I recently heard Mchale Mann in an interview say we need to reduce emissions to prevent the 6th mass extinction from starting. He is either lying or completely uninformed. The biology people have been debating if the the 6th mass extinction has started since at least the 1980s and now there is no longer any real debate - it's well under way. Then there's the IPCC bullshit pathways that are pure fantasy based on negative emissions, based on not yet invented technologies. Giving people false hope is the worst lie of all. Inertia is a bitch.



Fires Rapidly Consume More Forests and Peat in the Arctic
The wildfires exacerbate climate change

http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... he-arctic/

………………………………………………………..

Permafrost: hiding a climate time bomb?

http://phys.org/news/2015-11-permafrost-climate.html
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 06:09:46

Inertia is a bitch.

As in ignorant zombies still walk the Earth so how can we change anything when people are being deceived and lied to and do not even want to wake up. As AP so eloquently points out we are apes who like to feel good, nothing necessarily good now about the state of the world.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 09:17:29

Things pretty much remain the same:
Image

I started posting here at PO.com a couple of years ago. In that time, total world energy from FF consumption has increased from 78% to 86%.

Progress?
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 09:55:22

Considering the difference was mostly Indians & Africans & Chinese burning straw & cow shit, probably yes.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 10:01:48

just highlights that overpopulation is making things so much worse, how you going to stop so many people from trying to cook their food or keep warm.
Not to mention burning down more lumber and trees for more agrarian use.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 10:23:23

SeaGypsy wrote:Considering the difference was mostly Indians & Africans & Chinese burning straw & cow shit, probably yes.


The difference was mostly Chinese burning coal, and to a much lesser extent Indians burning coal:

Image

Nor are things looking good:

Image
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby AgentR11 » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 13:00:36

I think the EIA chart is exceptionally naive with regard to coal. China does talk a good game, and they do want less coal burning in air that is shared by their cities; but that doesn't imply an end to coal, it implies a whole new beginning because there is air and water available to manage coal burning generators just a little bit further North. And those who are just a little bit further North are absolutely busting their butts to make it possible to burn said coal, and sell the electricity to China, and sell it at a price they can hardly refuse. Be honest, does anyone in Moscow give a flip about smog East of Lake Baikal?

I know what they "say"; but I'm a big believer in ignoring what politicians say, and watching what they do. What I see, is stuff being built right this moment, by people that have more oil, coal, and steel than they know what to do with; stuff like rail, pipelines, bridges, and long distance electric transmission lines; all suitable for moving coal to a good spot, burning it, and then pumping that electricity back to China.

Your inflection on the coal line is the wrong direction. I expect it to accelerate 2030-2060.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 13:13:10

here is a link to some information regarding plans of China and Japan to increase coal use via construction of new coal plants. One good note though US is cutting back and scrapping some of theirs.
http://instituteforenergyresearch.org/a ... ding-them/
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 13:38:08

onlooker wrote:... plans of China and Japan to increase coal use via construction of new coal plants. One good note though US is cutting back and scrapping some of theirs.


US coal production is going up. Why? Japan has almost no coal. They have to import it all with a good part of it coming from the USA. Other countries also import US coal.

Its tricky accounting for coal consumption and its CO2 emissions. Yes the US is cutting back on our own coal power plants, but the US still mines lots of coal only that coal now goes overseas. If the US mines the coal and ships it to Japan and Europe, who is responsible for the CO2 produced from the US coal? Is the US responsible, since we produce the coal, or can the US export all the coal it wants with the CO2 bill the responsibility of the country that buys US coal for use over there?

Image
US coal exports, especially to Asia and Europe have grown rapidly since Obama became President in 2009. Is this good for the climate? No----but as long as US coal isn't burned in the US, its not counted against the US carbon production limits.
Last edited by Plantagenet on Sat 21 Nov 2015, 13:43:17, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 21 Nov 2015, 13:42:50

I would say Plant, that as a matter of common sense and fairness, the end users and emitters of the coal should bear the most responsibility as my link refers to China and Japan planning wide scale construction of coal plants. So the vast majority of the localized effect will be where the factories/plants are emitting the coal. Now certainly the trafficking in coal and subsequent coal emissions is responsibility of both buyer and seller.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Sun 22 Nov 2015, 11:06:13

There are two things that prevent the balance of trade with China from becoming one way in the direction of the USA. Those two things that we sell a lot of to China are food (mostly grain, but all forms of food) and coal. With the raw efficiency of US mechanized food production, that food actually pretty much represents petroleum fuels and LP vehicle fuels and petroleum-based fertilizers and insecticides transformed.

Seven railroads and extensions of existing rail lines were built by private industry to connect US and Western Canada coal fields to Western ports. You can go to Sacramento CA and watch hopper cars of coal being loaded onto the bulk COSCO (China Ocean Shipping Company) collier ships by automated machinery.

I mention this because the conventional railroad lines and extensions and all the coal handling machinery were all built within a span of five years, for less total money than the State of California has spent simply studying the proposed high speed rail between the SF Bay Area and Los Angeles. It is a startling confirmation of that which we all know so well: governments cannot do anything quickly, efficiently, or well. Private industry regularly and efficiently delivers when there is a buck to be made.

Being an AGW skeptic, I regard anything which prevents foreign ownership of more of the USA as good. We really will sell coal and grain to the Chinese over the following decades, and in the process reverse the existing unfavorable balance of trade.

Image

But within three decades even the massive US supplies of coal will peak and coal exports will begin a slow decline. China has that long to arrange to feed it's growing population using renewables, or there will be war. I think Nuclear Armageddon is that far away - unless some fool of a Democrat who actually believes the AGW myths gets elected and puts an end to coal exports - in which case, that war will likely inconvenience ME.

But the USA has one asset that is holding the Chinese dragon at bay:

Image

....and one truth that is making fools out of anybody so naive as to believe that government exists "for the people" versus the oligarchs.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby ennui2 » Sun 22 Nov 2015, 13:24:03

KaiserJeep wrote:Being an AGW skeptic...


Being an AGW skeptic, you have no reason to contribute to this thread.
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sun 22 Nov 2015, 22:07:30

KaiserJeep wrote:We ... will sell coal and grain to the Chinese over the following decades


Not necessarily. At some point we may elect a President who is serious about cutting CO2 emissions to combat global warming, and mining and exports of coal will be curtailed.

Of course it will too late to stop sea level rise and other effects of global warming by then, but when things get bad there is no telling what steps the US government will take. You know the old saying---the US government always does the right thing----they just have to do all the wrong things first. :lol:
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Revi » Tue 24 Nov 2015, 15:13:04

They have cancelled the climate rally already on the 29th, and they will probably cancel all outdoor activities that involve the public as well.

http://ecowatch.com/2015/11/16/events-c ... ate-talks/

It will be a pretty dull conference, and do you think all those people will hang around for the days and days it requires to hammer out an agreement?

I wish they would change the venue to some place outside of Paris where they can provide security, but it may be too late now...
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Plantagenet » Tue 24 Nov 2015, 16:38:06

Paris is probably the safest spot in the world now.

The French have Gendarmes on every corner, with heavily armed French Army paratroopers on the ready if anything goes south. And Belgium is doing its part to roll up the Islamist terror networks there.

Viva la France!
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Revi » Mon 07 Dec 2015, 15:16:55

True, it's probably pretty safe right now. I hope they figure something out. We'll see...
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Re: Right-Wing Spin against the UN Climate Conference

Unread postby Lore » Mon 07 Dec 2015, 17:03:41

I just saw the movie "An American in Paris" yesterday. Everything looked fine there.
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
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