Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Here's an idea: exercise power.

Discussions of conventional and alternative energy production technologies.

Here's an idea: exercise power.

Unread postby mortifiedpenguin » Wed 27 Oct 2004, 17:12:57

After thinking about this for a while, I think that with some fine-tuning, this would actually not be a bad idea. You could pay people to run on treadmills, which would generate electricity. It would be like wind power, except that the windmill (treadmill) would always be spinning.

People getting tired after running for a while? No problem, just switch them out with another person. You could hire a bunch of people and get them to run in shifts.

Also, treadmills are cheap to build. Way cheaper than a windmill. There's no energy cost to run them, since the people would be the energy. And unlike windmills, the treadmills wouldn't stop when there's no wind. As long as you have a person running on the treadmill, it would never stop, except for when it needs maintenance.

Also, not only could this solve our electricity problem, it could solve America's obesity problem. Clever, eh?

The only problem I can think of is that not much energy would be produced. But if you had a lot of people running at the same time, that coud generate a lot of energy.

So, what do you think? Could it be possible?
mortifiedpenguin
Peat
Peat
 
Posts: 114
Joined: Fri 15 Oct 2004, 03:00:00

Re: Here's an idea: exercise power.

Unread postby rerere » Wed 27 Oct 2004, 17:30:22

mortifiedpenguin wrote:The only problem I can think of is that not much energy would be produced.
So, what do you think? Could it be possible?


Average fit male human peddling - 200 Watts. Lance Armstrong peak power - 644 Watts.
Used bikes (2) - free
Low RPM motor as generator - $50 to $300
New Bearings - $30.

Cost per kWH - $0.08 kWH

5000 hours of peddling to 'recoop' power generated on low end. Ignores cost of circuity and other expenses.

Look at flip side - Man's labor is worth, say 150 watts and hour. One $660 150 watt solar panel is worth one man while sun shines. Said panel doesn't eat, and works for 20+ years.
User avatar
rerere
Coal
Coal
 
Posts: 422
Joined: Fri 27 Aug 2004, 03:00:00

Re: Here's an idea: exercise power.

Unread postby big_rc » Wed 27 Oct 2004, 20:56:10

mortifiedpenguin wrote:
Also, treadmills are cheap to build. Way cheaper than a windmill. There's no energy cost to run them, since the people would be the energy.

So, what do you think? Could it be possible?


Cute idea but there is always going to be an energy cost or the plan will be impossible (according to the wonderful laws of thermodynamics which state that there is no free lunch). Have you factored in the massive amounts of food/calories that your professional energy generators will need to keep going day in and day out? Also have you ever jogged/ran/excercised for a continuous hour? Think about how tired and hungry you were after you were done. I'm not saying your idea won't work, just flesh it out a little bit.
Simon's Law: Everything put together falls apart sooner or later.

I don't think of all the misery, but of all the beauty that still remains.--Anne Frank
User avatar
big_rc
Coal
Coal
 
Posts: 478
Joined: Sat 17 Jul 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Amerika (most of the time)

Unread postby NeoPeasant » Wed 27 Oct 2004, 21:30:10

Exercise power is a good Idea if you simplify it to :Ride a bike to work whenever you can. The energy you "create" is the gas you save plus the energy savings of deferring the maintenance and replacement of a car that sits quietly in the garage until it's needed.

I figure I "create" about a half gallon of gasoline every day by making my 10 mile round trip commute on my bike.
NeoPeasant
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1003
Joined: Tue 12 Oct 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby savethehumans » Wed 27 Oct 2004, 23:16:21

Uh--water wheels have run, WITHOUT electricity, for centuries! :)
User avatar
savethehumans
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1468
Joined: Wed 20 Oct 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby bentstrider » Thu 28 Oct 2004, 00:47:51

NeoPeasant wrote:Exercise power is a good Idea if you simplify it to :Ride a bike to work whenever you can. The energy you "create" is the gas you save plus the energy savings of deferring the maintenance and replacement of a car that sits quietly in the garage until it's needed.

I figure I "create" about a half gallon of gasoline every day by making my 10 mile round trip commute on my bike.

Speaking of two-wheeled vehicles, the states should just allow people with just a car license to ride motorcycles.
Who cares if people get careless and bust their heads.
It could be an indirect version of population control through promoting carelessness.
bentstrider
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 375
Joined: Mon 25 Oct 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Southern California Desert

Unread postby frankthetank » Thu 28 Oct 2004, 00:58:59

benstrider..

I agree. Motorcycles are so dangerous and it seems that everyone on them only has a learners permit anyways. Very good way to get rid of people:)
User avatar
frankthetank
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6201
Joined: Thu 16 Sep 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Southwest WI

Unread postby clv101 » Thu 28 Oct 2004, 01:19:09

NeoPeasant wrote:Exercise power is a good Idea if you simplify it to :Ride a bike to work whenever you can. The energy you "create" is the gas you save plus the energy savings of deferring the maintenance and replacement of a car that sits quietly in the garage until it's needed.

I figure I "create" about a half gallon of gasoline every day by making my 10 mile round trip commute on my bike.


You've hit the nail on the head there!
User avatar
clv101
Heavy Crude
Heavy Crude
 
Posts: 1050
Joined: Wed 02 Jun 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Bristol, UK

Unread postby jpatti » Thu 28 Oct 2004, 08:19:57

I've wondered about the energy profit in grains.

We grind our grain here for bread and other baking. Grinding grain is hard work. My husband attached a bicycle to the grinder to make it easier to work, as it's easier to use the large muscles of your legs than your arms.

I figure with the grinding and baking bread by hand, the bread has enough kilocalories to make up the work of making the bread and have some surplus. But I think we work off close to half the kilocalories in making the stuff. And that is starting from grain, when most of the work is already done!

What I wonder about is... when you have to till a field, plant, cut the wheat, shock it, harvest it, thresh and winnow it... all by hand labor, how can there be an energy surplus in grain?

There *must* be as our ancestors who developed agriculture were successful, which they wouldn't be if they expended more kilocalories producing food than they gained from the food. Just... it doesn't seem to me there can possibly be *much* of a net gain.
User avatar
jpatti
Peat
Peat
 
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue 19 Oct 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Carlisle, PA

re:

Unread postby duff_beer_dragon » Thu 28 Oct 2004, 09:59:21

Yeah,

there are - springs that store kinetic energy, like those used in wind-up powered radios for example. You wind it up for so many turns and get x-amount of playtime.

Exercise machines in exisiting or new gyms could feasibly be used to do such - the work is done anyway as of now, the energy could be stored in DC banks and used to feed the Grid for example.

Again, it's the sort of thing that would have been considered and implemented in gyms anyway, if the people who were meant to be in charge and making the decisions had been able to do so from the start of Industry. So it's another example of something that would work, but to re-do it now would take more effort than if it had been done properly to start with.

(I find gyms really unhealthy - they sell terrible unhealthy food, people use poisonous cosmetics and deoderants in them, and they rarely have fresh air ; they have mirrors all over the place (awful energy!) and they stink and often play music - which tends to be terrible too, so you smell sweat from people who mostly eat junk food and pork for example and then an overtone of some nose-destroying cosmetic perfume evil. The other problem they will need to overcome is the same one the car industry fell for - too much electronic gadgetry. Lose it all. All you need is a clock or a stop watch, and clearly marked settings for weights and difficulties on exercise machines.)


I got attacked by some moron over at the Marshall McLuhan forums for posting information about the kinetic-charged springs. I'll bet they are a net-troll on this forum as well and read this post here.
the frogurt is also cursed
duff_beer_dragon
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 218
Joined: Mon 04 Oct 2004, 03:00:00
Location: the Village

Unread postby Optimist » Thu 28 Oct 2004, 17:38:26

Average fit male human peddling - 200 Watts. Lance Armstrong peak power - 644 Watts.

An average household (US) uses between 750 and 1,000W of electricity. So you will need 4 - 5 fit males (24/7) to power the average household. Then you have not yet factored in the unavoidable energy losses.

More exercise would be good, but it won't threaten the oil sheiks.
User avatar
Optimist
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 219
Joined: Tue 28 Sep 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby BastardSquad » Fri 29 Oct 2004, 09:33:02

I think Duff Beer Dragon and NeoPeasnat are on the right track.I don't think human power would be of much use for producing electricity on the grid,but just doing little things in our daily lives would make a big difference.

Spring powered mechanisms like wind up alarm clocks will probably alot more popular in coming years.I had one of those windup radios but the spring broke :x .

How many people do you suppose use their dryer to dry their clothes on days when they could just as easily hang them on a clothes line?One thing that really amazes me is how many people are complete sissies when it comes airconditioning.I rarely use mine,only on the absolute hottest days,and if my wife wouldn't whine I wouldn't use it at all.I just can't believe how many people,when the temp hits 85,start cranking their ac's.It blows me away everytime I here someone say "it's soooooo hot out,if I don't get in where it's cool I'm gonna die"I just want to slap them.The pioneers didn't have ac and they managed to get by just fine.
User avatar
BastardSquad
Lignite
Lignite
 
Posts: 289
Joined: Sun 24 Oct 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby Kingcoal » Fri 29 Oct 2004, 09:53:38

Peak Oil should make electricity more expensive, but it will probably be down on the list of priorities, at the top of which will be transportation, food, heating fuel.

I have an idea: The shiverator. It generates electricity from shivering motions. The only thing required is a cold human.
User avatar
Kingcoal
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 2149
Joined: Wed 29 Sep 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Pennsylvania, USA

Unread postby khebab » Fri 29 Oct 2004, 10:57:49

NeoPeasant wrote:Exercise power is a good Idea if you simplify it to :Ride a bike to work whenever you can. The energy you "create" is the gas you save plus the energy savings of deferring the maintenance and replacement of a car that sits quietly in the garage until it's needed.

I figure I "create" about a half gallon of gasoline every day by making my 10 mile round trip commute on my bike.


Why not forcing people to go to work in bike if they live less than 6 miles away from their work place (that's what I do every day and I'm fit like hell [smilie=cachas.gif] ). City's downtown should be car free and become more like Tiananmen Square back in the old days when Chinese where smarter.
khebab
Tar Sands
Tar Sands
 
Posts: 899
Joined: Mon 27 Sep 2004, 03:00:00
Location: Canada

Re: re:

Unread postby rerere » Fri 29 Oct 2004, 21:08:43

duff_beer_dragon wrote:there are - springs that store kinetic energy,


Please post watts per gram and cost per watt.

duff_beer_dragon wrote:I got attacked by some moron over at the Marshall McLuhan forums for posting information about the kinetic-charged springs. I'll bet they are a net-troll on this forum as well and read this post here.


Please provide link so Aaron can see if you said something more amazing than what you post here!
User avatar
rerere
Coal
Coal
 
Posts: 422
Joined: Fri 27 Aug 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby gg3 » Sun 31 Oct 2004, 01:44:19

Yow!, so close but so far! Y'all missed a really obvious application! Simply require by law that any new equipment installed in an exercise gym, also produce electricity and connect to the grid.

Think of the energy produced & wasted in all of those "nasty smelly" exercise gyms every day. What would it cost to build exercise machines that turned generators rather than e.g. lifting weights or otherwise producing nothing more than heat? Probably not much, considering the high cost of all these "high tech" exercise machines (most of the "high tech" aspects of which are merely frills, as someone noted).

Now look at a case of a typical exercise gym. If you have e.g. 50 people in a room, producing 200 watts each, that's 10 KW constant output. Feed it through a battery bank merely for the sake of power conditioning, and feed it back into the grid.

If the concept proves technically feasible, it's the kind of thing that could reasonably be required by law for all exercise gyms to install. The gyms would recoup costs by selling power back to the utilities, though perhaps it would take a few years as somone pointed out. Some kind of government loans (or loan guarantees) or favorable tax treatment could be used as a positive incentive.

Another possibility: gyms that are selling power, might have a lower cost structure than gyms that are letting it go to waste. This might be a source for a rate reduction to members, thereby providing a market mechanism that favors the energy-producing gyms over the energy-wasting ones. So if "Green's Gym" is doing better than "Gold's Gym" on this, there's an incentive for Gold's to install these machines also. Ideally it's better to work this through a market mechanism than through regulation; the hard question is finding investors for the first example.

Also worth noting, people often go to the gym after work, which is a peak electricity demand period. So you get power on the grid at a time when it's more needed.
User avatar
gg3
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 3271
Joined: Mon 24 May 2004, 03:00:00
Location: California, USA

Unread postby tmazanec1 » Sun 31 Oct 2004, 06:36:38

A few months ago, Wired magazine had a "Found" page (last printed page) of a combined gymnasium/power plant.
tmazanec1
Tar Sands
Tar Sands
 
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue 12 Oct 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby WebHubbleTelescope » Sun 31 Oct 2004, 15:58:58

tmazanec1 wrote:A few months ago, Wired magazine had a "Found" page (last printed page) of a combined gymnasium/power plant.


This has been posted at
http://mobjectivist.blogspot.com/2004/09/nrg.html

Image

Buy Bruce McCall
User avatar
WebHubbleTelescope
Tar Sands
Tar Sands
 
Posts: 950
Joined: Thu 08 Jul 2004, 03:00:00

Unread postby JLK » Sun 31 Oct 2004, 16:10:02

I have been thinking about this idea for a long time. I think he would actually worked pretty well as a marketing ploy for exercise machine manufacturers. Go to the club and do some social good as well.

In addition, just imagine the potential that exists in the corrections industry! :roll:
www.searchingforthetruth.com

The truth that is suppressed by friends is the readiest weapon of the enemy.
- Robert Louis Stevenson
User avatar
JLK
Peat
Peat
 
Posts: 187
Joined: Fri 21 May 2004, 03:00:00
Location: East Coast USA


Return to Energy Technology

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 41 guests