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The Financial System is Destroying the World Economy

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Sun 20 May 2018, 21:06:52

pstarr now has reality-free posts. I don't know what happened, he was a valued contributor at some point. He won't talk about it which is his absolute right. Nowadays he spends his time exaggerating things all out of reason, and seldom contributes anything of value.

The "Great Recession" was a piker compared to the "Great Depression":
Image

You know what else? We are entirely over the recession, and the economy has fully recovered, and people are still blaming "the economy" for being themselves too lazy to work, or for the bad decisions they made.
KaiserJeep 2.0, Neural Subnode 0010 0000 0001 0110 - 1001 0011 0011, Tertiary Adjunct to Unimatrix 0000 0000 0001

Resistance is Futile, YOU will be Assimilated.

Warning: Messages timestamped before April 1, 2016, 06:00 PST were posted by the unmodified human KaiserJeep 1.0
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Mon 21 May 2018, 03:21:11

pstarr wrote:I know outcaste. That "not-so-bad" worst recession of all time wasn't even bad for you, because you are brilliant. And you have good constitution and morals.

And all that pain from the ("not-so-bad" worst recession of all time) wasn't really all that bad because it was only the worst "recession" (cough cough cough) of all time. And not really the never-ending worst depression of all time.

And most certainly the ("not-so-bad" worst recession of all time) had nothing to do with $100/barrel crude or $5.00 gasoline.
/sarc

Keep dreamin' Keep token'


So no facts at all, eh? Just further signs of mental instability, like "never ending worst depression".

Right. Let's claim a "depression" is persistent economic growth for a good 9 years (since the end of the last recession). Why not claim an economic depression is also a rainbow while we're at it? /s

Economists acknowledge high oil prices were likely a SECONDARY factor in the great recession -- just not at all the primary cause you keep maintaining without any credible evidence.

Do you know that the toking you're interested in re the Stoner University is different than a token? You seem to be just further and further detached from reality.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby asg70 » Mon 21 May 2018, 09:09:22

"Oh my where to start with you guys."

A rather arrogant tone to strike from someone who starts a thread with a typo in the subject.

BOLD PREDICTIONS
-Billions are on the verge of starvation as the lockdown continues. (yoshua, 5/20/20)

HALL OF SHAME:
-Short welched on a bet and should be shunned.
-Frequent-flyers should not cry crocodile-tears over climate-change.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Mon 21 May 2018, 10:40:02

Sys1 wrote:Very simple :
The global economy is collapsing since 2008. Just watch global debt chart and you will get we have a problem.

If debt were the ONLY measure of financial health, then that might indeed be a big problem, but knowing the timeframe is problematic.

But of course, debt is NOT the only metric. And the vast majority of overall financial metrics are improving markedly over time, which is why the fast crash crowd is cherry picking debt. (When Cassandra needs to cry "instadoom" weekly, she needs something to point to).

All the debt might be a problem, but with only zerohedge style finger pointing without substance, doomers aren't defining anything and thus lack credibility. With a track record of decades of frequent bad calls, that just makes things worse for that credibility.

And now that oil is going up again, central banks are gameover :

Funny, when oil was cheaper, the constant cry from fast crash doomers was that the banks were DOOOOOMED due to unpayable debt by the oil companies. Now that the oil companies are in or near record profits, raking in many $billions of profits a quarter that doesn't fly (though we still see the nonsensical meme of oil fracking being unprofitable at any price :roll: ).

So now it's DOOOOOM to the banks if the oil companies make lots of money and pay their loans back?

Sure looks like another swing-and-a-miss to me. But hey, thanks for playing.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby jedrider » Tue 22 May 2018, 16:05:09

Cog wrote:
Sys1 wrote:KaiserJeep : Then what the fuck are you doing on a doomer site, moron?
You should go writing your BS on Fock News, wou will be far better welcomed than here.


This is not a "doomer site". This is a site to discuss the implications of oil depletion. The fact that there are doomers like you here, simply means the board staff are tolerant of your nonsense.


Yes, that was a bit over the top. However:

The 'implications of oil depletion' is DOOM.
The 'implications of climate change' is DOOM.
The 'implications of financialization' is DOOM.

I see a common thread there :-D
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Tue 22 May 2018, 16:14:41

jedrider wrote:
Cog wrote:
Sys1 wrote:KaiserJeep : Then what the fuck are you doing on a doomer site, moron?
You should go writing your BS on Fock News, wou will be far better welcomed than here.


This is not a "doomer site". This is a site to discuss the implications of oil depletion. The fact that there are doomers like you here, simply means the board staff are tolerant of your nonsense.


Yes, that was a bit over the top. However:

The 'implications of oil depletion' is DOOM.
The 'implications of climate change' is DOOM.
The 'implications of financialization' is DOOM.

I see a common thread there :-D

Oil depletion may take a LONG time, and there are growing alternatives, via green energy and conservation.
Financialization is doom. Yeah, right. Because living in a cave is so much better than having a mortgage. :roll:

Well, you got one out of three right. AGW looks really bad, since we keep doing nothing meaningful about it. That's long term doom, however, not the constant bad calls of we're doomed next (week, month, year - depending on the post), made by the fast crash doomers.

And it's not that it's impossible to fix. It's more, how much will it cost and how many deaths of possibly billions must result, the longer we delay. Am I optimistic we'll fix it any time soon? Sadly, no.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby ralfy » Tue 22 May 2018, 22:44:45

It's more like a combination of multiple crises. More details here, but the data does not factor in the effects of climate change, which should make matters worse.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby KrellEnergySource » Wed 23 May 2018, 21:48:42

Debt, in many cases, is a voluntary thing.

But I didn't volunteer the US Goverment to place us 21+ trillion dollars into debt. ~$174,000 per taxpayer. But yet we need to lower taxes NOW, according to everyone that runs for office.

My house is paid off. My car is paid off. Not a single person in our government has talked about paying off the big one.




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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Newfie » Thu 24 May 2018, 15:14:33

They have no intention of payin it off.

Nor any plan to deal with the consequences.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 24 May 2018, 17:28:57

Newfie wrote:They have no intention of payin it off.

Nor any plan to deal with the consequences.

Even if they wanted too, they couldn't !
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Cog » Fri 25 May 2018, 08:23:15

As long as the interest on the debt can be serviced(paid) then there is no problem.

As of 2017 the interest on the debt was $263 billion or 6.8% of the federal budget
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 25 May 2018, 12:37:17

Cog wrote:As long as the interest on the debt can be serviced(paid) then there is no problem.

As of 2017 the interest on the debt was $263 billion or 6.8% of the federal budget


Yup, and what the "debt will kill us all real soon now" folks don't seem to get is what likely happens if interest rates rise meaningfully due to higher inflation. The interest payments on the debt that rolls over rise, sure. But the value of ALL the debt falls with the inflation. So there's a lot of balancing that goes on, for relatively trustworthy currencies. (Like the US dollar, whether the fast crash doomers like it or not).

So what's bad is if the debt gets very big compared to the size of the economy in debt.

But for that to happen, the debt has to grow meaningfully faster than the economy for a long time.

So it's debt to GDP that matters, and that's rising, ballpark in the range of 1% a year in the US. That's a meaningful problem in the longer term, but 7% or even 15% interest burden isn't going to collapse the economy. Historically, things have tended to get out of hand in the ballpark of an interest burden that's 40% or more of the economy.

Japan has a government debt to GDP ratio of over 236%, yet they're doing OK. The US is in 14th place at under 108%. Nothing to brag about but NOT short term catastrophe territory either.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... ublic_debt
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby onlooker » Fri 25 May 2018, 12:49:42

Actually, my bad. The thesis should have been the financial system and the attendant needs and wants of all the humans is destroying the Environment of the world in terms of favorable habitation conditions. I notice that some of you do not spend to much time on the Environment forum. Well, I am making a post there that will be titled "BAU is the final nail in the coffin" . Because while some of you do make some keen points about how the Economies of the world are still functioning and staying afloat. Every day modern civilization and our huge numbers are debilitating the resiliency of the Biosphere and its ability to sustain life. So, I know this is a PO site but we all know this is the case but some of us are more forthright about it.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Newfie » Fri 25 May 2018, 13:34:08

Somehow I came across this book “Time Blind” by Jack Albert.

Not sure but I think it may explain a lot.

It’s available as a free download.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 25 May 2018, 14:00:00

Newfie wrote:Somehow I came across this book “Time Blind” by Jack Albert.

Not sure but I think it may explain a lot.

It’s available as a free download.

Any hints? I'm not finding good hits for finding a "Time Blind" book, downloadable or not, by a Jack Albert.

I'm finding that title by another author, an author called Albert Jack, etc.


Thanks
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby roccman » Fri 25 May 2018, 14:07:19

onlooker wrote:Actually, my bad. The thesis should have been the financial system and the attendant needs and wants of all the humans is destroying the Environment of the world in terms of favorable habitation conditions. I notice that some of you do not spend to much time on the Environment forum. Well, I am making a post there that will be titled "BAU is the final nail in the coffin" . Because while some of you do make some keen points about how the Economies of the world are still functioning and staying afloat. Every day modern civilization and our huge numbers are debilitating the resiliency of the Biosphere and its ability to sustain life. So, I know this is a PO site but we all know this is the case but some of us are more forthright about it.


There was a time when humans lived in equilibrium with the earth...one tribe...one law. That was a very long time ago. The mob being given breeding rights changed things. As such, equilibrium was lost and the default button pushed...that is - the mob will assist with building an ark, but will not be invited on the ark. The sooner folk realize that the mob has killed earth and that those in power have been forced into the defacto alternative - more time can be spent by the individual designing a way to attach a dingy to the ark.
"There must be a bogeyman; there always is, and it cannot be something as esoteric as "resource depletion." You can't go to war with that." Emersonbiggins
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby onlooker » Fri 25 May 2018, 18:47:45

https://srsroccoreport.com/global-finan ... increases/
The U.S. and global economies are choking on a massive amount of debt. While Wall Street and the Mainstream financial media continue to rationalize the skyrocketing debt as merely the cost of doing business, the disintegrating fundamentals point to an economic catastrophe in the making.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Newfie » Sat 26 May 2018, 02:33:17

Outcast_Searcher wrote:
Newfie wrote:Somehow I came across this book “Time Blind” by Jack Albert.

Not sure but I think it may explain a lot.

It’s available as a free download.

Any hints? I'm not finding good hits for finding a "Time Blind" book, downloadable or not, by a Jack Albert.

I'm finding that title by another author, an author called Albert Jack, etc.


Thanks


http://www.skil.org/Time_Blind_book_folder/TB_head.html
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 26 May 2018, 02:53:37


Ah, thanks. Jack Alpert. No wonder I wasn't getting hits.
Given the track record of the perma-doomer blogs, I wouldn't bet a fast crash doomer's money on their predictions.
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Re: The financial system is destrohing the world economy

Unread postby kanon » Sun 27 May 2018, 11:23:37

This topic is as old as the hills. Simply do a search for "usury in the middle ages" and you will find numerous research papers covering usury from ancient times to the recent past. The modern central bank system is a usury system and the facts of oppressive debt, imminent financial collapse, and widespread debt slavery are features of this usury system and also of usury in the past. What is perhaps unique to this modern system is the way corporate propaganda has been able to disguise usury as an "economics" issue. Here is a link to a fairly quick read that lists a number of issues concerning usury:History of Usury
RATIONALE FOR THE CRITIQUE OF USURY
Throughout the history of the criticism of usury, various reasons and rationale have been forwarded in support of this position. While some are unique to particular traditions or individuals, many tread on common ground which this section will briefly attempt to synthesise.
Usury as Unearned Income . . . .
Usury as Double Billing . . . .
Usury as Exploitation of the Needy . . . .
Usury as a Mechanism of Inequitable Redistribution of Wealth . . . .
Usury as an Agent of Economic Instability . . . .
Usury as Discounting the Future . . . .

I had never heard of the author before I did the search and my cursory scan of the paper shows no exceptional insights. I suspect that a brief study of the history of usury would uncover detailed analogies to the entire spectrum of "economics" issues we face today, as well as corollaries to all the talking points we hear from pundits and analysts in the media.

I suppose that one would have to account for the tremendous wealth and population expansion made possible by fossil fuels which has made this usury system more long lasting than past examples.
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