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The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Discussions of conventional and alternative energy production technologies.

Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Wed 21 Jun 2017, 12:22:08

I guess if it's hydro you don't even need batteries...With no grid, getting rid of excess power can be a challenge. I would think in Panama you don't need much hot water. 2500 watts 24/7 of hot tub makes me think of Bugs Bunny trying to boil two tropical dudes in a pot. :-D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyHoK9RVIrw

Sorry, I couldn't resist. You could have a fountain, or an electric kiddie train that wanders the property, or battle boats on the lake :)

OK...peace and quiet...how about a big stone earth globe that floats above a pedestal so people can spin it. I saw one at the Denver NS museum that used water pressure. And all I could think was 'I wonder how much power that uses?'
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Mon 03 Jul 2017, 07:19:26

Yesterday my wife and I pulled wires into the buried conduit. It was a complete pain in the ass. First I couldn't push the fish thru cause it was catching on the transition from schedule 40 to schedule 80 PVC (extra protection where it emerges from the concrete). So I used a vacuum to pull a string thru and tried to pull the wires...the string broke. So I used the string to pull the fish into the conduit and then pulled the wires with the fish. I also used a bunch of hypo-allergenic lube. Those electrons will appreciate that :) All done now but I will admit it wasn't so easy...now I call in the inspection.

Here is an example of theory vs application. I did my homework...It was all supposed to fit and work...but it was still a pain in the ass. I should have used bigger conduit.

Maybe I should have waited for Plug and Play :) But where's the challenge in that...
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Thu 20 Jul 2017, 08:58:12

Hooray...

I just passed inspection on the first try. He was asking me questions about Solar PV and how it works. I gave him my card and offered to answer questions anytime.

Now Duke power has two weeks to replace my meter with a bi-directional unit and I will be making $0 marginal rate Solar power (free) :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Thu 20 Jul 2017, 10:13:29

For those of you who want to see some guts :)

Guts.jpg
Guts.jpg (136.23 KiB) Viewed 4018 times


You see the Current Transformers (CT's) on each circuit in the critical loads panel. I stuffed the slack into the box at the top since I plan to move them around over time. These are what tell the Eguage real time loads on each circuit.
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Thu 03 Aug 2017, 14:32:30

Well isn't that just typical...Duke power waited until the last possible moment to meet their obligations and replace my meter. More power from them...less from me.

It's OK I still have 12 days left before they read the meter. I will zero out my July electric bill with 12 good sunny days :)

I turned it on and it started making 5 kW. I still have to finish the detailed software configs to get it all reporting and making pretty graphs. I'm going to try to make those public in real time, so you folks can check up on me anytime :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Fri 04 Aug 2017, 18:39:28

Ok Folks, I think I got a little carried away. As usual...

Today was a typical partly cloudy day here in NC. It just now rained for 10 minutes. The first full day of life for my personal power plant and it made 29 kW-hrs.
https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/ ... 1e899b37db

I have been aiming at a moving target here. I have watched my electric bill go down for 5 years as I add new tech and change old systems. I started planning this PV project a year ago before the new house insulation and Mini-split heat pump were done. I knew it would help but I never expected this. There has only been two weeks so far that I have run the AC. I have left it set on dehumidify and the house has stayed comfy. I estimate it runs at about 2000 BTU. I just looked at my electric bill on-line. My usage from June 14 - July 17 was 296 kW-hrs, less than 10 kW-hrs/day. Last year with the old window unit it was 581 kW-hrs. Almost twice.

I always oversize :) I have a '63 VW beetle with 200 HP from a previous life. I bought as much solar as I could afford...I expected to produce twice what I need, looks like it may be three times as much.

You think I am jumping to conclusions? I haven't even started fine tuning. This was not a good solar day in NC. I will beat this production many times in the future.

So I guess I need two electric cars. Actually an overproduction of 20 kW-hrs represents almost 100 miles of charge in an electric VW. In one day.

Since I keep up with these things...I did two jobs today, billed $425, and traveled 115 miles.

I guess this really is going to fall together after all :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 04 Aug 2017, 19:04:41

baha wrote:So I guess I need two electric cars. Actually an overproduction of 20 kW-hrs represents almost 100 miles of charge in an electric VW. In one day.

Since I keep up with these things...I did two jobs today, billed $425, and traveled 115 miles.

I guess this really is going to fall together after all :)

Or you could have one EV with a long range (you like Tesla, right?), and let some reasonable neighbor charge their EV for cheap now and then when you have a big bubble of extra power (like full backup batteries, and lots of sun). So you could help pay for the cost of your system over time, give your neighbor a partial break on his/her power rate for charging their EV (since the A-hole power companies pay consumers so little for their power).

Seems like everybody wins. I still question whether selling such power by discharging a $multi thousand dollar power-wall battery (or three) will make economic sense (we'll have to see how long such things really last with heavy use), but if you have extra power just pouring in from the sun, then using/selling it is better than giving it to the power company or bleeding it off, at least it seems to me.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Fri 04 Aug 2017, 20:42:20

Hi OS,
Don't be dissing my non-existant electric VW. I can have as much $range$ as I $want$.

This is the way I do things. I will build an electric VW much more efficient than a Tesla. Start with hand-powered roll down windows, no power steering or brakes, and a transistor radio :) The target weight is 2259 pounds fully charged, plus me and my tools.

I love when a plan comes together :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Fri 04 Aug 2017, 21:30:06

baha wrote:Hi OS,
Don't be dissing my non-existant electric VW. I can have as much $range$ as I $want$.
er steering or brakes, and a transistor radio :) The target weight is 2259 pounds fully charged, plus me and my tools.

I love when a plan comes together :)

Oops. Sorry. My old brain forgot about your VW EV. My bad on that.

I think I remember you being somewhat enthusiastic about what Musk and Tesla are doing generally, and extrapolated from THAT -- forgetting your earlier posts about your plans for the VW EV.

No insult intended -- I just have finite time (to look back through threads) and memory, so sometimes I take a shot based on what I do remember, and sometimes I'm just wrong.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Sat 05 Aug 2017, 07:26:24

No worries OS,
I am enthusiastic about everything I do, until I get tired of it :)

Your comment about 'power just pouring in from the Sun' needs to be developed. The concept of free power is hard for people to understand, even me. I have spent my entire life being an energy miser. Now I have to reverse my thinking process. I have excess power coming out my ears :) I can quit worrying about light switches and thermostat settings and start enjoying myself. Finding new ways to use daytime power will be fun. I really could build a fountain that shoots water 100' into the air and charge admission. But in reality I will convert everything I have to electric power and run the stuffing out of it.

It is a new concept to realize I have an energy budget. Use it or lose it.

In the long run I expect society to force Duke power to pay for renewable energy put on the grid. At that point I will go back to my miserly ways and rake in the bucks :)

For example...I just turned on the heated dry option on my energy star dishwasher. I have never used that before :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby Outcast_Searcher » Sat 05 Aug 2017, 11:40:16

baha wrote:For example...I just turned on the heated dry option on my energy star dishwasher. I have never used that before :)

That concept to me is the most wonderful thing about the concept of running an EV off of a solar roof (or a highly green public electric company). The idea of being able to take an (almost) guilt free (the car still does have an embodied energy footprint, and things like tires still wear out) long ride in the country on a nice day with the sunroof cracked is a real turn-on to me.

I used to love to do that before I learned how much AGW is in our face, and I just don't want to do that in an ICE any more -- which is where most of my annual mileage reduction down to 4000 came from.

By all means, enjoy your free extra energy! And if my votes have anything to do with it, electric companies will have to buy extra consumer electricity for a high percentage of what they charge ASAP.
(If they don't like that, they can do something else for a living).
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Mon 07 Aug 2017, 18:45:21

Thank you OS,
You're support, and everyone else here, means a lot to me.

My AC-coupled Tesla Powerwall 2.0 arrived today. We had a staff meeting at 4pm and we all went out to the warehouse to admire the two pretty Powerwall boxes :) Can't wait to see inside but I'm busy right now. And I want to see the bill first.

Tesla wants to review our/my drawings and possibly send a rep for some of the first installs...I am hoping Elon will come on out to the farm and hang out for a while :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Wed 09 Aug 2017, 08:19:37

Apparently I can't make the really pretty graphs public. I am not allowed to share my usage data (thru Solaredge). Makes sense, someone could tell when you are at home.

So I took a screen shot to make my point.
Screen Shot 2017-08-09 at 8.35.36 AM.png
Screen Shot 2017-08-09 at 8.35.36 AM.png (149.93 KiB) Viewed 1695 times


There has not been a clear sunny day yet. The day shown was partly cloudy with some rain at the end. The red is what I used from the grid. The blue is what I made and used myself. The green was exported to the grid. Imported 5.19 kW-hr, used 2.59 kW-hr of my own power, and exported 16.66 kW-hr...in one day.

Here's another day.
Screen Shot 2017-08-09 at 8.34.46 AM.png
Screen Shot 2017-08-09 at 8.34.46 AM.png (199.47 KiB) Viewed 1695 times


This day was totally overcast and raining. We stayed inside and ran stuff, washed dishes, clothes, vacuum etc...And yet...I Imported 6.78 kW-hr, used 4.99 kW-hr more, and exported 5.49 kW-hr. Almost a wash...

Now substitute a 15 kW-hr Tesla Powerwall for the grid. On the first day I ran it down 1/3 at night and it was charged back up before noon. On the rainy day I ended with the Powerwall down by 1.29 kW-hr. That means I can weather 11 days of rain and clouds before the battery is dead. This doesn't account for efficiency losses but they should be about 10%. So only 10 days...

People think intermittant solar power means on or off. It's not like that. It's just variable. A small battery is enough to even it all out. And I can control my usage as well. The only time I will see 10 days with no Sun is when Yellowstone goes off...But when the sun comes back out and my panels are cleaned I will start back up :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Fri 11 Aug 2017, 08:09:42

:) I am having such fun :)

Wednesday the Sun was really out. I noticed the system was 'clipping' at 5500 watts. It was limiting it's solar output to 5500 watts. Here is the fine tuning. I tried some stuff and discovered how to limit export power myself...For the first part of Thursday I operated it purely in self-consumption mode. It's output followed my loads while using the grid as a battery.

At the same time I put in a call to Solaredge tech support. They accessed it remotely, discovered it had commissioned itself as a 5000 watt inverter and self limited. They updated the firmware and recommissioned it as a 7600 watt inverter with a limit of 8400 watts (surge power).

Remember this is cutting edge, tech support has a dedicated number for the 7600 Lithium battery based StoreEdge inverter. It's OK as long as they make it work...This is the kind of testing I will do with the Powerwall.

At 3pm I shut it down, changed parameters, and started up with the new 8400 watt limit. And of course the next few days will be cloudy. You just wait, she'll be cranking soon :)

Screen Shot 2017-08-11 at 8.48.05 AM.png
Screen Shot 2017-08-11 at 8.48.05 AM.png (156.18 KiB) Viewed 1270 times
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Sun 13 Aug 2017, 06:06:32

I have been reading discussions about solar power here on Peakoil for years. It's always been about how intermittent solar cannot meet our needs and complicates Duke powers life. Most people like the idea of no CO2 but use the so-called limitations to dismiss it. They certainly aren't going to pay big money for something that can't meet their needs. And most grid-tied installations I do will not power a house without the grid available. They install it to save money and CO2.

I am a solar installer, I usually don't jump into those discussions because people think I have an agenda...I do...to expose the truth. I waited until now because I knew no one can argue with the facts, OK, almost no one :) I am presenting real data to you so you will have facts to base your opinion on.

I am also a design engineer. I know how the process works. There are many variables. Requirements, capabilities, time constraints, money. Most people obsess over the money. I am not driven by money! That's probably why I don't have very much. I always spend it on quality tools and toys :)

When I design and build something for myself I start from the requirements and work backwards. My requirement was to be fully grid independent while enjoying life like I always have :) I really don't understand installing solar that stops working when the grid is down. To me that defeats the whole purpose.

When I do these things, I grit my teeth, focus on the goal, and try not to think about all the money I am spending...it is also just a tool. I haven't added it all up yet, I'm going to let my wife do that when we file taxes. But I have a rough idea.

I spent $9k on solar equipment, maybe another $2k on wire and electrical parts. The bill for the Powerwall is $6005. We will be starting the install Friday. So I spent about $17k. I get 30% back from the feds so call it $12k. I think that is reasonable for complete independence of the grid and CO2 for the rest of my life.

I'm an old solar dude and as long as parts are available I will make this damn thing run until I die :x

This is me...I get carried away :) You could do the same thing for about the same price. I really only needed half my system for the house, the other half is for the EV. I expect anyone could install a $12k system (after tax rebate) that will make a large portion of your house grid independent. Is that so bad?

Forgive me if I laugh when I hear excuses about how solar can't support our way of life. Maybe you should change your way of life...or maybe you should talk with a design engineer who actually knows something about it :)
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Tue 15 Aug 2017, 06:38:30

No one wants to criticize? I have a secret that must be told...

This system can run my AC all summer and smile. The real test comes this winter. Solar output goes down significantly during the winter solstice. And those mini-split heat pumps suck power (at night) when it gets really cold. My tolerance for rainy/snowy days will be reduced to about 2-3 days. I will report back then...

But don't worry, I have a plan...Long term I will heat my house with 4 - 4x10 solar thermal panels and underfloor radiant heat. The heat pumps will only be backup. That is the next project. The house comes before the EV.

I'm surprised Ghung hasn't called me out :) He knows about seasonal varience.

And Plantagenet...You are just screwed :) You might as well hold your breath until the Sun comes back out.
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Tue 15 Aug 2017, 10:01:32

In all honesty, and not wanting to spoil your euphoria, I have to point out a few things.

1) You are not a typical power consumer. You are designing a system and refurbishing a home that can be run on solar energy without hydrocarbon burning in everyday operation. This is both expensive and complicated, beyond the capabilities of most electrical consumers. The implementation of your system is largely a DIY matter, whereas most people would have to pay somebody to do these same things, and their costs would be much greater than yours.

2) You live in a relatively mild climate in a Southern US state. If I end up in a situation where I am building versus buying a home in Wisconsin, I will have a much harder design hurdle than yours, both because the solar flux is lesser, and because the HVAC energy needs are higher, especially in Winter. Most US consumers would fall between these two extremes, but not all. For example, residents of the Florida peninsula would have greater A/C energy requirements than you, and residents of Alaska would have greater heating requirements. These are the real extremes, and solar or solar plus wind would still need backup energy sources for most existing residences, not to mention new ones built to more stringent standards such as PassivHaus or LEED Platinum.

3) There are greater challenges than design in some situations. For example, the Mother-In-Law's house that the wife and I just inherited on Nantucket. That house is 20+ years old, built to an HVAC standard that is completely obsolete, with leaky windows and doors, and run by a combination of electricity and a single oil burner that supplies hot water baseboard heat and domestic hot water. You or I could easily solve these problems without the interference of the HDC (Historic District Commission) on that island. The HDC is fiercely protective of the look and feel of the 17th century structures that exist there, the external appearance of anything must get their approval before a building permit is issued. How many 17th Century period-correct solar arrays have you designed? The 17th century version of wind power looks like this:
Image
....and turns dried corn kernels into corn meal. The cost of electricity on Nantucket has recently declined from more than $0.35 per kWh to about $0.147/kWh, not because of alternative energies, but because they replaced the island's diesel generators with an undersea power feed from Cape Cod, where the Koch Brothers sell hard coal to various power plants. I don't know of any remaining solar or wind contractors on Nantucket, which happens to be on the NASA list of the 10 best sites for wind power, but the island will probably will get bounced from the list next time because it would be hard to compete with cheap coal.

4) One of my own design goals in Wisconsin, assuming I am designing and building versus buying an existing structure, is to have a system that is operable via a non-technical person, either the wife or the new owner of my home. I will therefore endeavor to keep the local electrical inspectors happy by employing electrical contractors and architects familiar with alternative energy systems. I am anticipating that the cost per square foot will be relatively high, mainly because of the $100,000 per acre costs for beachfront property near Lake Michigan. Not to mention that the Nantucket home is on $1,000,000/acre real estate, in a pine forest 3/4 mile from the beach (beachfront costs $10,000,000/acre there). I mention this because many people have external design requirements such as keeping a spouse happy, or a very picky HDC, that you apparently do not. So let me simply ask: will your wife be able to operate and maintain your energy system after your death, or will the new owner of your property? Or will YOU, without access to Internet tech support?

Again, the last thing I want is to spoil your enthusiasm. But you are ignoring constraints that most people would have to face, and (concerns for TEOTWAWKI aside) will probably never produce electrical power competitive in cost to the $0.117/kWh that is the national average. Still, I love reading your messages, and encourage you to continue - and to get your wife's input regularly. Mine, for example, values a European vacation more than alternative energy systems.
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby baha » Tue 15 Aug 2017, 15:07:41

Hi KJ,
You're right...and wrong :)

1. My systems are cutting edge and yet off the shelf. They are expensive and complicated just like your computer or fuel-injected car/truck. Once I have finished the install it will run hands-off unless there is a failure. My hot water system has been 100% available for 5 years and all I do is listen to it gurgle :) One of the reasons I am doing this is so I can do it for my customers as well. And yes, you will have to pay me. But I can make you CO2 free.

2. Solar power brought me to NC. I'm here because of the market. But you can find answers in other places. A ground source heat pump is a great answer in WI or Nantucket. And solar power can be tuned for winter production by adding tilt to the array (within limits) or a tracker. The real limit is how much room you have for collectors and how much you can spend. Unless you live in Alaska, then it's about storage.

3. Politics sucks...I understand history. If you want a monument, give tours. If you want to live there, be reasonable. In fact you can build an insulated shell inside a home like that and be ok. I wouldn't...I won't buy land that someone else thinks they can control. But I would love to have an old Texas windmill hooked to a generator, that would be cool :)

4. OK, I'm skipping around. I hope as these technologies develop and contractors get more comfortable the premium you pay for efficiency will go down. All houses should be built and renovated with energy use in mind and the govt and your vote can help with that. What I did was not terribly expensive, it was labor intensive and time consuming so I spread it over 6 years. Renovations can be done the same way.

The sad truth is, as long as the grid is up, my system is 100% hands-off for anyone. If the grid goes down for more than a week...it will take some tweaking :) My wife says she knows what to point at if it quits :) and what number to call. My company sticker is attached to the inverter.

She pushed me hard for that trip down the Grand Canyon. Trip of a lifetime...remember. She can stop bothering me now. Maybe after we retire. But our idea of a vacation is camping in the mountains by a creek, that's cheap :) The real problem is we may want to move to the mountains by a creek when we retire. Then I have to start over or pay the big money :)

A meaningful tax on CO2 would get rid of that old coal bucket.
A Solar fuel spill is otherwise known as a sunny day!
The energy density of a tank of FF's doesn't matter if it's empty.

https://monitoringpublic.solaredge.com/solaredge-web/p/kiosk?guid=19844186-d749-40d6-b848-191e899b37db
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Tue 15 Aug 2017, 17:34:01

Baha, consider that if the grid goes, so does the internet, within hours. The servers and backbones are mostly on battery UPS systems, with a few hours ridethrough. The backbone systems have dual power feeds, as do hospitals, and a grid outage would likely take out both feeds. Parts of the grid have diesel backup, most do not - and such backup lasts as long as you have fuel storage, and then it goes away.

FWIW, I don't think that Tesla Powerwalls, Tesla Vehicles, or Tesla Superchargers will be operable in a widespread grid outage. I'm sure also that in an Internet outage, old fashioned lead acid cells like GHung uses are more dependable, even if obsolete and relatively low tech. Take a hard look at the CPUs and control electronics of the Powerwall, and tell me if you could repair it when broke. Got a Logic Analyzer and PCB fixtures for it? Got schematics? Got Diagnostic software that runs on a test system, not the product itself? (This was my trade, remember. The test equipment and external diagnostic software are much harder to design than the product itself.)
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Re: The Rise of the Personal Power Plant

Unread postby pstarr » Tue 15 Aug 2017, 17:49:52

You are correct, KJ. I too have a fancy grid-tied PV system recently upgraded to about 5kw of panels. I also have a hydronic floor heating, solar thermal hot water and trombe wall. The rest of my home is near-LEEDS certified. For instance, all interior walls are 2*6 insulated framing etc.

But I don't expect it all to be worth much more than crapola when the grid goes down. That's why I also have a nice wood burning stove, an acre of redwoods, and a growing orchard/woodlot of hardwood orchard trees and alders. Plus a few live oaks.

I also have a 125' deep-well that now has a AC motor for draw and household pressure. I have considered converting it to DC and installing a storage tank on the hillside behind my house. Theory being: the DC pump operates off the PV panel when sunny, drives water up hill for storage and enough pressure to at least feed my faucets. But this is all doom talk, and you guys are not interested in that. You guys are going to save the world lol
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