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Doomer Logic Glitch

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby baha » Fri 17 Mar 2017, 05:16:21

My current position is there is more than enough CO2 already in the atmosphere to end humans. My fascination with geology makes it hard for me to think short term. My personal lack of descendants means my only immediate concern is survival. I don't see peak oil as an existential threat. In fact, if we survive, the whole industrial revolution will be just a blip in the human story. If we don't survive it will be what ended us!

So the alternative is human survival and success...
Our most effective weapon is our minds. We only use it to the greatest effect when we are threatened with destruction. As weather events kill more and more people we will begin to see the threat for what it is and start spending the time and money needed to address the issue. All we are left with is geo-engineering so we will develop processes to remove CO2 from the air and sequester it underground. It will be based on natural processes. The end product (algea based slime) will be very similar to oil and will be injected into abandoned wells in Texas under supervision of the ROCKMAN. The existing wind farms will be used to power the process.

In the meantime small mirrors will be seeded into the arctic vortex to cool the local area and allow the ice cap to reform bringing the weather back into BAU. So Planty can safely go fishing.

Of course these processes will take at least 50 years to make a difference so the end population of 1 billion will have a much better chance of survival. Colonies on Mars will have to wait for the next technical revolution when we find a truly sustainable energy source. Unfortunately KJ passed on when the interplanetary shuttle suffocated on methane farts.

After another 1000 years the next Ice age will be unavoidable and we will dig all that shit up and burn it all over again :)
Last edited by baha on Fri 17 Mar 2017, 06:10:09, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby baha » Fri 17 Mar 2017, 05:27:30

I've got a better idea...we could just nuke Yellowstone or Campi Flegrei and the resulting Mega-eruption would cool the planet for several decades and kill off 6 billion people very quickly :)
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby baha » Fri 17 Mar 2017, 11:51:50

I forgot to mention onlooker and Ghung sitting in the background eating popcorn and giggling :)
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby ralfy » Fri 17 Mar 2017, 13:09:28

Squilliam wrote:I would say the glitch is between 2. and 3. Even if oil peaks it isn't the death-knell to the global economy people say it is. Oil is a 3 factor product to begin with. It is a source of energy, a storage medium for energy and a pre-cursor product for other useful products. Even if it loses importance as a major source of energy it will still be important for 2/3. The question really is more about whether the global economy can replace oil as a source of energy. I think that it is possible because renewable energy can take a lot of the slack with respect to overall energy production, and alternative transport options will become increasingly important as oil becomes expensive because it will make other choices relatively better. Electric trains and cars as well as bikes can get people where they need to go, and what's better is that their production relies on electricity or coal.


Renewable energy has low energy returns and quantity. You will find more details in other threads in this forum.
http://sites.google.com/site/peakoilreports/
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby Squilliam » Fri 17 Mar 2017, 20:49:55

ralfy wrote:
Squilliam wrote:I would say the glitch is between 2. and 3. Even if oil peaks it isn't the death-knell to the global economy people say it is. Oil is a 3 factor product to begin with. It is a source of energy, a storage medium for energy and a pre-cursor product for other useful products. Even if it loses importance as a major source of energy it will still be important for 2/3. The question really is more about whether the global economy can replace oil as a source of energy. I think that it is possible because renewable energy can take a lot of the slack with respect to overall energy production, and alternative transport options will become increasingly important as oil becomes expensive because it will make other choices relatively better. Electric trains and cars as well as bikes can get people where they need to go, and what's better is that their production relies on electricity or coal.


Renewable energy has low energy returns and quantity. You will find more details in other threads in this forum.


I am aware of what renewable energy can and cannot do. I am a veteran of The Oil Drum.
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby ralfy » Sat 18 Mar 2017, 21:18:09

Squilliam wrote:
ralfy wrote:
Squilliam wrote:I would say the glitch is between 2. and 3. Even if oil peaks it isn't the death-knell to the global economy people say it is. Oil is a 3 factor product to begin with. It is a source of energy, a storage medium for energy and a pre-cursor product for other useful products. Even if it loses importance as a major source of energy it will still be important for 2/3. The question really is more about whether the global economy can replace oil as a source of energy. I think that it is possible because renewable energy can take a lot of the slack with respect to overall energy production, and alternative transport options will become increasingly important as oil becomes expensive because it will make other choices relatively better. Electric trains and cars as well as bikes can get people where they need to go, and what's better is that their production relies on electricity or coal.


Renewable energy has low energy returns and quantity. You will find more details in other threads in this forum.


I am aware of what renewable energy can and cannot do. I am a veteran of The Oil Drum.


Then you know that it's not possible for renewable energy to replace oil.
http://sites.google.com/site/peakoilreports/
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby AdamB » Sat 18 Mar 2017, 21:30:29

Squilliam wrote:I am aware of what renewable energy can and cannot do. I am a veteran of The Oil Drum.


The second sentence discredits the first. Not only did the Oil Drum not know much about renewables (not a surprise, it wasn't called "The Renewable Drum" after all), but it also turned out to not know much of anything about fundamental resource economics as they relate to oil. You might as well claim to have been a veteran of LATOC, when it comes to how reality treated the visions of those two blogs.
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby baha » Sun 19 Mar 2017, 07:32:02

The purpose of this exercise is not to analyze someone else's logic. But to gain insight into your own. What is your expected end game...and how can we avoid it?
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Re: Doomer Logic Glitch

Unread postby baha » Tue 21 Mar 2017, 08:41:20

I just tried to access this thread and got a SQL error "too many connections". Does the system know me well or what? I think my argument against technology has pissed off the cloud :)
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