THE Fracking Thread (merged)

[dissident]

There really is not a realistic 'debate' about whether we are going to Frack. We are going to frack, frack, frack. We are going to pulverize this Earth and squeeze out every last economically recoverable drop of burnable solids, liquids and gasses. Nothing will stand in the way of that.

The real debate should be about what we do with the energy we are using up. We can talk about whether it's a good idea to use it up as fast as we possibly can, but fast or slow, what are we doing with it ? Are we doing anything with it that will help us get by when it's petering out ? Or, not? Right now it looks like not.

We are not going to extract every last drop because we will start feeling the effects of agricultural collapse long before that stage. But it is apparent that only when we have serious pain then we will get action on climate change. For now it is just academic flatulence that the elites can ignore. The left and the right are both united in the lemming rush over the cliff.

[Tanada]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... sfeed=true

The Royal Academy of Engineering and the Royal Society said in a report published on Friday that the UK's current regulatory systems were sufficient for shale gas fracking if they were adequately enforced, but also said that closer monitoring of shale gas exploration sites should be put in place, in order to ensure their safety.

They asked for new monitoring systems for "fracking" – the fracturing of dense shale rock under intense pressure of jets of water, sand and chemicals – a process that has already resulted in two small earthquakes in the Blackpool region, from the first two shale gas wells to be drilled in the UK.

Looks as though the UK will green light Fracking and secure natural gas supplies for some time to come even as the North Sea fields deplete out of economic extraction. Russia should worry, if this catches on they will not be able to sell nearly as easily to Western Europe as they could a decade ago.

[dinopello]

North Carolina Governor vetoes bill that would have allowed fracking with minimal environmental protections in her state

Positive and negative reaction:

"We applaud Gov. Perdue for listening to the people of this state and vetoing this misguided piece of legislation," said Molly Diggins, state director of the Sierra Club.

But delay means North Carolina is missing out on jobs and profits flowing to other states, said Dallas Woodhouse, state director of the conservative group Americans for Prosperity.

She will approve fracking eventually though

Perdue has expressed tempered support for hydraulic fracturing if the right regulations are in place and it can be done safely to protect drinking water and citizens. She agreed with supporters of fracking that it could help create jobs and lower energy costs.

Crack that mutha open!

[Maddog78]

The one good thing is that fracking is basically a hysteria driven by hopes and desires and not real reserves. The natural gas price will shoot up once this bubble of delusion bursts.

where do you think the huge increase in natural gas production came from in the US? Why do you think the natural gas price is so low?
This hardly speaks to delusion but rather to success.

Not sure where those not in the oil and gas industry get this idea that shale gas is somehow in peoples imagination. There has been an immense amount of success in North America.

Haha, hey rockdoc, it sounds like this guy learned all he could from the resident n. gas expert, pstarr.

[dinopello]

Well North Carolinia is going to frack themselves up good, because a legislator pushed the wrong button. She deserves the boot for that one.

A North Carolina state representative says she voted mistakenly to override the governor's veto of a bill to allow the shale gas exploration called "fracking" but was told she couldn't change it because this would have altered the outcome.

Democratic Rep. Becky Carney of Charlotte says she pushed the green "yes" button at her desk Monday night to override Democratic Gov. Beverly Perdue's veto of the measure before realizing she wanted to vote red, or "no."

Her "yes" vote made the tally 72-47 – just above the 60 percent required to override in the Republican-controlled Legislature. The chamber's rules prevent members from changing a vote if it affects the outcome.

Carney had voted earlier against fracking. She said Tuesday she feels terrible about her error but acknowledged the bill passed legally.

Where's the gas ?

Potential gas formations in the Triassic Basins are underneath or upstream from public drinking water supplies for 2.4 million people in North Carolina, stretching from the densely populated areas of the Triangle through the Sandhills to the South Carolina state line. Other communities downstream withdraw drinking water from the Lumber, Cape Fear, Neuse, and Tar Rivers. A smaller area of the shale occurs along the Dan River in Stokes, Rockingham, Yadkin and Davie Counties.

[Plantagenet]

Where's the gas ?...Potential gas formations in the Triassic Basins are underneath ... public drinking water supplies for 2.4 million people

Gosh...all kinds of things might be down there underneath the drinking water supplies. Don't forget that evil fluoride is in the rocks undersea the public drinking water supplies too. How about salt? Too much salt will kill you and there is salt in rocks. And bacteria---scientists have shown there is a huge ecosystem of subterranean bacteria that is underneath, above and even IN the groundwater. Icky poo. I'm sure you'll come up something really scary to stop frakking if you fearmonger long enough.


How about giant frakking worms?

[dinopello]

Gosh...all kinds of things might be down there underneath the drinking water supplies. Don't forget that evil fluoride is in the rocks undersea the public drinking water supplies too. How about salt? Too much salt will kill you and there is salt in rocks. And bacteria---scientists have shown there is a huge ecosystem of subterranean bacteria that is underneath, above and even IN the groundwater. Icky poo. I'm sure you'll come up something really scary to stop frakking if you fearmonger long enough.


How about giant frakking worms?

What the frak are you talking about? Hysterical much ?

[Plantagenet]

I'm sure you'll come up something really scary to stop frakking if you fearmonger long enough.


How about giant frakking worms?

What the frak are you talking about?

I'm trying to help you with your efforts to portray frakking as being dangerous.


Frakking is, like, science and and war and stuff like that, dude. Its so unhip.

[dinopello]

I'm trying to help ...portray frakking as being dangerous.

Even if you could prove frakking is dangerous, it wouldn't matter. We will continue to frak as long as there's money to be made. We are going to frak this planet up, down and sideways. Once structural transportation demand is in place through conversion of trucking fleets to NG - frakking operations will accelerate and will be pervasive wherever there is a whif of gas. You might as well sit back and enjoy the show and not worry about it.

[Plantagenet]

We will continue to frak as long as there's money to be made. We are going to frak this planet up, down and sideways. Once structural transportation demand is in place through conversion of trucking fleets to NG - frakking operations will accelerate and will be pervasive wherever there is a whif of gas. You might as well sit back and enjoy the show and not worry about it.

+1

You are frakking right!

WSJ reports a group of Chinese engineers and scientists were just in Oklahoma learning how to frak, and now they are going back to China to teach their fellows how big-time frakking is done in the U. S. of A.----it just makes me glad two years ago I travelled the Silk Road across the Gobi Desert--- there were some small oil fields out there and now China is going to turn it into the Frakking Road.


Silk Road across Gobi desert -- soon to be frakked

Going rafting down the Grand Canyon the next couple of weeks. Shouldn't be any frakking down there, anyway!


THANK GOD the USA invented National Parks so there will be always be a few places safe from frakking.

[dinopello]

THANK GOD the USA invented National Parks so there will be always be a few places safe from frakking.

Dream on, God isn't going to save the National Parks or National Forests. They will be frakked as long as there is gas and and economic return.

[Plantagenet]

THANK GOD the USA invented National Parks so there will be always be a few places safe from frakking.

Dream on, God isn't going to save the National Parks....

You go dream on---your fantasies of frakking in the National Parks are silly. You obviously don't understand what the National Park System is all about.

[dinopello]

You obviously don't understand what the National Park System is all about.

Why don't you enlighten us. There are already hundreds of oil and gas operations in 13 national parks, ranging from Big Cypress National Preserve in Florida to Padre Island National Seashore in Texas. Why would frakking not be allowed ? Cuyahoga NP is likely to be frakked up soon.

[dinopello]

Hydraulic fracturing fluids are primarily water. This fluid is pumped under pressure underground, and then it is allowed to flow back to the surface, where it is captured and disposed of under applicable EPA and UIC rules, the Marcellus frac water for example is being put on rail cars and disposed of in Ohio.

Apparently one of the (non-secret) ingredients is guar gum, like they use in ice cream. Prices are going up though.

Once utilized as cow fodder and for poor man’s curry, the guar bean is now a key element in the chemical cocktail used to frack wells, the technology that has prompted the oil and gas boom sweeping across North America, and is set to spur a worldwide boost in oil and gas recovery. India produces some 80% of the world’s guar gum, a hydrocolloid — a substance that forms a gel when mixed with water.

The rising price of the gummy gold was blamed by Halliburton late last month for a decrease in profits so far this year. “The price of guar gum has inflated more rapidly than previously expected due to concerns over the potential for shortages for the commodity later in 2012. As such, the costs have impacted the company’s second quarter North America margins more than anticipated,” the company asserted in its earnings statement.

[steam_cannon]

As fracking continues to grow as a portion of our energy picture it also attracts a lot of negativity like coal and every other form of energy. The article below addresses some of this negativity. Of course this article is industry pushback pr bs. A fair amount money spent on forced SEO marketing to push this article into the headlines. That said, any thoughts on the points they are pushing? PR or a some good points? Either way, it's news...

Article: Some fracking critics use bad science

PITTSBURGH — In the debate over natural gas drilling, the companies are often the ones accused of twisting the facts. But scientists say opponents sometimes mislead the public, too.

Critics of fracking often raise alarms about groundwater pollution, air pollution, and cancer risks, and there are still many uncertainties. But some of the claims have little — or nothing— to back them.

For example, reports that breast cancer rates rose in a region with heavy gas drilling are false, researchers told The Associated Press.

Fears that natural radioactivity in drilling waste could contaminate drinking water aren't being confirmed by monitoring, either.

And concerns about air pollution from the industry often don't acknowledge that natural gas is a far cleaner burning fuel than coal.

"The debate is becoming very emotional. And basically not using science" on either side, said Avner Vengosh, a Duke University professor studying groundwater contamination who has been praised and criticized by both sides.

Read more...

[dinopello]

Nationwide Insurance will not cover damage from fracking.

The memo reads: "After months of research and discussion, we have determined that the exposures presented by hydraulic fracturing are too great to ignore. Risks involved with hydraulic fracturing are now prohibited for General Liability, Commercial Auto, Motor Truck Cargo, Auto Physical Damage and Public Auto (insurance) coverage."

It said "prohibited risks" apply to landowners who lease land for shale gas drilling and contractors involved in fracking operations, including those who haul water to and from drill sites; pipe and lumber haulers; and operators of bulldozers, dump trucks and other vehicles used in drill site preparation.

Kind of suprising considering how much of the country could be exposed to fracking (regardless of what you think the risk level is). Nationwide could lose a lot of business if other insurance companies will insure against fracking related damages.

[Plantagenet]

You obviously don't understand what the National Park System is all about.

There are already hundreds of oil and gas operations in 13 national parks, ranging from Big Cypress National Preserve in Florida to Padre Island National Seashore in Texas.

You obviously don't understand what the National Park System is all about.

National Parks are are not the same as National Preserves and National Seashores. In particular, national parks have a higher level of environmental protection then other federal lands.

Cheers!

[diemos]

You obviously don't understand what the National Park System is all about.

All those in favor of frakking the National Parks?

Aye.

Motion passed.

That's all it takes for those protections to disappear.

[Pops]

Is this becoming a trend?

Analyst: Calif. shale oil field results disappoint

A California oil field thought to be one of the biggest in the U.S. has been producing much less oil than hoped, according to a report by Alliance Bernstein analyst Bob Brackett.

[rockdoc123]

Pops I think the telling comment in this article is

But drillers haven't been able to get the Monterey Shale to produce oil at high rates. Brackett suggests that there are a few characteristics of the geology that could make the field more difficult to develop. There are lots of natural faults in the rock, which means drillers can't easily control the flow of oil through faults they create. Also, the rock is not under enormous pressure, so there is less force pushing the oil to the surface. And the oil may be relatively thick and sticky, which slows its flow.

Basically it isn’t analogous to other liquid rich shales such as the EagleFord which tends to be free of natural fractures and is overpressured. Most importantly my understanding is that the oil in the Monterey tends to be quite heavy (9 to 11 API) with surface temperature viscosities up to 10,000 cp. In comparison EagleFord oil has API in the mid-thirties and higher with viscosities in the tens of centipoise range.
To put that in context if you look at normal recovery factors for heavy oils from conventional reservoirs with similar rheology to the Monterey oil you are generally thinking of primary recovery from cold flow of not much more than 10%. In contrast light oil pools can see recovery factors in the 40% to 50% range, all other things being equal.