THE Retirement Thread (merged)

[vision-master]

but it answers the ultimate question of how the feds will raid the retirement accounts of the middle class

Tell me how this works.....?

I thought the numbers were clear enough in my simplified presentation.

Say you're some middle class Joe with a retirement account of some sort, and you've just hit 68 and retired.

That retirement account can now be thought of as an annuity, equal to a series of payments distributed across your (and your cohorts) average life expectancy. Say that equivalent to an annual pmt of $25k / yr till death (and death of spouse, as applicable).

Say SS pays $30k / yr.

Congress passes law X: Defense of Social Security Against Mean Ole Rich People Act of 2014. Sum of law is as follows: Social Security is means tested such that the annuitized value of the person's available assets act to reduce the amount paid by Social Security to the recipient. IE, you get a check for $5k/yr from SS, because you are rich and have assets saved for your retirement, thus you do not need it, thus are means tested out of the bulk of the benefit.

The government didn't tap any account with your name on it, so no transfer or confiscation happened; and yet your financial position ends up being identical to the folks who did not save anything for retirement. They got $30k a year from SS; you got $5k a year from SS, plus you are permitted to keep your name on your IRA/etc account.

Its an Americanized version of confiscation. Slick as goose poop too.

Now, to be fair, I suspect they will bias it a bit, such that you come out slighty better off than the folks who saved nothing; but I wouldn't count on that difference being able to buy more than a couple TV dinners...

Pensions are underfunded bc Wall Street took em for a ride with toxic bundled mortgage-backed securities. The white shoe crooks did this intentionally.

[Loki]

Owning just a one acre lot and home, a possibility would be ag land, but that means rental to get income, and it is less liquid than we care for. Ag land values here have dropped dramatically since 2008.

Can you buy any adjacent land to your property? Re. ag land, if prices are low, maybe now is the time to buy. Leasing it out would allow you to let someone else lose money farming.

I’m in my late 30s, nowhere near retirement age, which is a good thing since I have zero retirement plan, aside from dying young (like most of the men in my family) or working until I drop. Peasantry doesn’t offer much in the way of retirement benefits. It’s not too late for me to get a long-term institutional position that offers decent retirement benefits, been looking at horticulture-related jobs at local colleges, but even that would be no guarantee. And such positions are the exception rather than the rule these days.

Farming certainly doesn’t provide much retirement security, unless I work on some mega-farm, or bought my own small farm. The latter would require a massive loan and an even more massive headache. Not sure I’m prepared for either. The long-term financial prospects are the main thing that gives me pause when I consider staying in farming. I am at least experienced at living poor, and don’t mind it much.

[patience]

Loki,

I think Ag land is worth trying. I'm not sure what I might be able to buy, if anything, adjacent to us. There is a very rough wooded parcel across the highway from us that could probably be bought. I'll have to inquire about that.

At present I'm leaning toward stock for re-opening our repair shop, keep some expense money in cash, and look at useful antiques as an investment. Things like wringer washing machines, lard presses and kettles, carpenter's tools, and blacksmith equipment, if these things could be had cheap enough.

A lot to park an RV trailer is also of interest.