THE Algae Thread (merged)

[peakoilishere]

Pstar, I wouldn't be surprised if it was billions. Exon has spent 300 million alone. Its sad though there throwing good money away after such a crappy idea. they really need to spend the money on developing energy resources like oil and natural gas.

[PrestonSturges]

The military is investing in this. They don't want to be stranded on the side of the road in case of mid-east war.

[Plantagenet]

[pstarr]

What an ugly unnecessary post. Could it have anything to do with your GW's foolish ethanol mandate?

Plant you really don't belong here anymore. I think you have outlasted your welcome.

[AdTheNad]

billions? I find that very hard to believe. they are not idiots.

Maybe if you include the money they spend advertising their investments into algae and being green.

[vtsnowedin]

Research into algae oil is what brought me to this web site in the first place. Work has been done on it going back to the Carter administration but low oil prices shoved it onto a back burner. Now that we are above $100 per barrel and rising algae oil is or soon will be viable. There is a lot of potential there. You can use dessert land which there is plenty of so your production does not have to compete with farmland producing human food. You can use sea water or brackish water unfit for other purposes. You can use human waste water as a fertilizer source while cleaning it at the same time and you can spur the growth of algae by bubbling CO2 through the water balancing other CO2 emissions.
It will never be a source of $2.50 gas but it may become cheaper then $8.00 gas pumped from the glowing hole that used to be Iran.

[AgentR11]

What an ugly unnecessary post. Could it have anything to do with your GW's foolish ethanol mandate?.

No where near as ugly as some of the posts here about Bush II during his reign.

[Outcast_Searcher]

Now that we are above $100 per barrel and rising algae oil is or soon will be viable. There is a lot of potential there.
...
It will never be a source of $2.50 gas but it may become cheaper then $8.00 gas pumped from the glowing hole that used to be Iran.

It seems to me that doing some research on potentially viable substitutes or alternatives for hydrocarbons is perfectly reasonable. How much should be spent and how soon -- well, that's what investment risk and the stock market is all about. I'm happy to see the likes of Exxon doing some research, and following up (rationally) based on how events unfold.

If we do nothing for a decade or three, things like Chindia and BAU growth will make $8.00 or higher gasoline a likely reality -- even IF the middle east manages not to become a post-war bombed out wasteland.

[SeaGypsy]

It was the oil from algae thing got me reading a lot more in 07/08.

One point missed in this thread is the market developing in carbon trading. Green credits are going to be hard to come by. Tree planting projects, wind and solar farms, then any form of carbon recycling or sequestration. Whoever gets this up and running at scale stands to be able to: get free credit for continued development, sell their 'green oil', hype themselves as 'eco-friendly', AGW activists. The annual turnover in carbon credits will quickly go to trillion dollar plus amounts over the next few years if it gets up worldwide. It is already up in the EU, Australia and NZ are bringing it in, most of Asia is in wait and see mode, the USG has it's fingers in it's ears singing 'La la la!'. Every country is politicking and bargaining for a place at the table and a slice of this new pie. It should come as no surprise billions are being spent in anticipation of this emerging market.

[vtsnowedin]

I am very dubious about all the carbon credit and carbon sequestration schemes.They may grow for awhile and millions or billions may get sucked up by shysters and wheeler dealers but I think in the end they will all be abandoned as not demonstrably effective or cost efficient.

[SeaGypsy]

I'm dubious on the long term benefit of the tech also, but I see collapse as likely to be partial, with all kinds of attempts at blowing bubbles meanwhile/ carbon credits being one of those schemes being designed by the globalists as a logical business strategy in a shaky global economy.

[Plantagenet]

Government support for algae fuel research goes back almost 30 years to the Reagan administration. The algae research program that Obama described in his state of the union speech was actually started by Reagan 30 years ago, was killed by Clinton 15 years ago, and now is being resurrected by the Obama administration.

Obama restarting Reagan-era project on algae fuel research


"The Reagan Administration and the national algal biofuels program

The vital pivot from hydrogen to transportation fuel as a product from algae was undertaken by the Reagan Administration, and was continued under the Bush Administration.

The program, in fact, was shut down under the stewardship of Secretary Hazel O’Leary, a Democrat serving under President Bill Clinton.....It goes back to why the algae R&D program was shut down. At the time, the researchers concluded that 1990s energy prices were too low by a third to support algal biofuels. That was in the days of $20 oil. They thought that oil would have to be at something astronomic, like $80 a barrel, for algal biofuels to make sense.

Times have changed. Oil hit $135 in 2008. Today, West Texas intermediate is at $106 a barrel. Miles above $80. That’s why the algal R&D was restarted. That’s why so many people are getting behind the technology."



Starting and stopping and then restarting government backed research on things like algae gasoline is not a national energy plan. This kind of short-term perspective is why we need a real national energy policy with a real plan for the future, not just knee jerk responses by politicians that come and go in response to spikes in gasoline prices.
.

[vtsnowedin]

The fact that the energy companies are now making their own investments in algae oil is a good sign. The money will be better spent then any government research grant and positive results much more likely. On the other hand this investment indicates that in spite of their public positions on Peak oil their actual opinion on the subject has come around to the position that substitutes will soon be needed and profitable.

[Sys1]

Algae technology is in the domain of Jaevon paradox. It is not a new energy but a way to improve the use of fossil fuels by using a part of wastes (CO2) currently produced to have more oil. By the way, be sure this "green" oil will be burnt and will in the end finish in the atmosphere.

[vtsnowedin]

Algae technology is in the domain of Jaevon paradox. It is not a new energy but a way to improve the use of fossil fuels by using a part of wastes (CO2) currently produced to have more oil. By the way, be sure this "green" oil will be burnt and will in the end finish in the atmosphere.

Properly done algae oil is a conversion of solar energy through photosynthesis into a storable liquid fuel. Much more then just a conversion of fossil fuel energy or an efficiency gain. To be sure of this production farms would have to operate pumps etc. on PV, wind or hydro power so there would be no fossil fuel inputs into the final product.

[bcole]

DOE BIOMASS PROGRAM AND ALGAE RESEARCHERS NEED TO BE INVESTIGATED!

Solydra story is opening a huge can of worms at the DOE LOAN GURANTEE LOAN PROGRAM. Its not just about the Solar loan guarantee program. Look at all the millions in fees collected by the DOE LOAN GUARANTEE PROGRAM with algae projects less than 20% completed. An audit is being done on all DOE GRANTS to algae researchers and ndividuals from the DOE that are now working in private industry. Very incestuous!

The US taxpayer has spent over $2.5 billion dollars over the last 50 years on algae research. To date, nothing has been commercialized by any algae researcher.

The REAL question is: Does the DOE BIOMASS PROGRAM really want the US off of foreign oil or do they want to continue funding more grants for algae research to keep algae researchers employed at universities for another 50 years?

In business, you are not given 50 years to research anything. The problem is in the Congressional Mandate that says the DOE can only use taxpayer monies on algae research, NOT algae production in the US. So far, algae research has not got the US off of foreign oil for the last 50 years!

A Concerned Taxpayer

ARPA-E halts algae project, citing missed milestones
Jim Lane | February 16, 2012
Share"In Washington, the DOE has halted a research project at Iowa State University funded by ARPA-E to develop biofuel feedstock from an aquatic micro-organism for failing to reach research milestones. About 56% of the $4.4 million grant was used. Politicians against increasing APRA-E funding as proposed by President Obama’s new budget are using it and other halted ARPA-E projects as examples to reject the program."

[vtsnowedin]

DOE BIOMASS PROGRAM AND ALGAE RESEARCHERS NEED TO BE INVESTIGATED!

Solydra story is opening a huge can of worms at the DOE LOAN GURANTEE LOAN PROGRAM. Its not just about the Solar loan guarantee program. Look at all the millions in fees collected by the DOE LOAN GUARANTEE PROGRAM with algae projects less than 20% completed. An audit is being done on all DOE GRANTS to algae researchers and ndividuals from the DOE that are now working in private industry. Very incestuous!

The US taxpayer has spent over $2.5 billion dollars over the last 50 years on algae research. To date, nothing has been commercialized by any algae researcher.

The REAL question is: Does the DOE BIOMASS PROGRAM really want the US off of foreign oil or do they want to continue funding more grants for algae research to keep algae researchers employed at universities for another 50 years?

In business, you are not given 50 years to research anything. The problem is in the Congressional Mandate that says the DOE can only use taxpayer monies on algae research, NOT algae production in the US. So far, algae research has not got the US off of foreign oil for the last 50 years!

A Concerned Taxpayer

ARPA-E halts algae project, citing missed milestones
Jim Lane | February 16, 2012
Share"In Washington, the DOE has halted a research project at Iowa State University funded by ARPA-E to develop biofuel feedstock from an aquatic micro-organism for failing to reach research milestones. About 56% of the $4.4 million grant was used. Politicians against increasing APRA-E funding as proposed by President Obama’s new budget are using it and other halted ARPA-E projects as examples to reject the program."

Who set the mile stones? Some aid to a congressman?

[bcole]

Neither Sapphire Energy nor the Algal Biomass Organization responded to requests for comment

BY: CJ Ciaramella - February 22, 2012 5:00 am
The federal government awarded Sapphire Energy, a green energy concern, more than $100 million for a project that is behind schedule, has only created a fraction of its expected jobs, and is, according to some experts, at least a decade away from creating a viable product.

Founded in 2007, Sapphire is working to develop algal biofuel—a replacement to crude oil made from algae and able to be refined into gasoline, diesel, or jet fuel.

Sapphire raised $100 million from private investment firms, including ARCH Venture Partners. Bob Nelsen, a founding partner of ARCH, served on Obama’s National Finance Committee during the 2008 campaign.

A Washington Post investigation found billions of taxpayer dollars flowed to green energy companies backed by venture capital firms with ties to the Obama administration.

Sapphire was no exception. In 2009, executives, board members, and employees at Sapphire contributed almost exclusively to Democratic campaigns. For example, Sapphire CEO Jason Pyle has donated only to Democrats, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

The company has received $104.5 million from the federal government, roughly half of which were 2009 stimulus funds from the Department of Energy, to build an algae-based biofuel operation in Columbus, New Mexico.

Sapphire has spent more than $1.8 million lobbying the federal government since 2008, with an appreciable spike in 2009, when there were several biomass-related bills up for consideration.

One such bill was the Algae-based Renewable Fuel Promotion Act of 2010, which would have expanded federal tax credits for biofuel to include algae-based fuels. It passed the House in 2010 but never made it to the floor of the Senate. The House bill was co-sponsored by Rep. Brain Bilbray (R., Calif.), whose district surrounds Sapphire’s San Diego headquarters. Bilbray is the only Republican to whom Sapphire executives and board members reliably contribute.

In 2011, the Algal Biomass Organization, which promotes the industry, hired one of the biggest law firms in the U.S., K&L gates, to advocate at the federal level. That same year, Tom Udall (D., N.M.) co-sponsored a new bill, the Renewable Fuel Parity Act of 2011, that would give algal biofuel the same tax breaks as other forms of biofuel.

There is considerable interest in developing algal biofuel. Sapphire was ranked 97 on a Forbes list of the most promising companies in 2011. There are several other companies working to develop the fuel as well.

However, like many stimulus projects, Sapphire’s new facility has faced delays. The plant was supposed to be operational by 2011, creating almost 750 temporary and 40 permanent jobs. But Sapphire did not break ground until June 2011.

In October 2011, two years after being awarded federal grants, the project had only employed 15 New Mexicans and spent $575,000. Sapphire Vice President of Corporate Affairs Tim Zenk told the Las Cruces Sun-News that the project has “a long ways to go.”

In November 2011, the federal government kicked more money Sapphire’s way—this time a $54.5 million loan from the Department of Agriculture.

According to the most recent quarterly report filed at Recovery.gov, the project is less than 50 percent complete and has created 36 jobs.

Questions have also been raised about the viability of algal biomass as an alternative fuel.

Mary Rosenthal, the head of the Algal Biomass Organization, predicted in 2010 that algal fuel could compete with oil within seven years. However, a 2010 report by the University of California Berkeley’s Energy Biosciences Institute said it would take a decade of testing to even determine if algae companies can produce mass quantities of fuel at competitive prices.

The fuel is not yet commercially available. The main consumer has been the U.S. Navy, which paid $12 million for 450,000 gallons of biofuel in 2011. That works out to $26.67 per gallon.

Neither Sapphire Energy nor the Algal Biomass Organization responded to requests for comment

[pstarr]

It appears that unwarranted algae-research grants are finally being questioned. I see a pattern here. -

--The Republicans rush thoughtlessly into an untenable program. GW Bush authorized the corn ethanol mandates under pressure from his cronies at ADM.

--The Republicans quickly abandon ethanol biofuels for a new distraction, 3rd generation cellulosic and algae scams

--- and then blame the Democrats for doing the difficult, dirty, adult work of cleaning the mess up.

yeah I see a pattern here.

[bcole]

Why have billion$ (yes billions) been poured into algae. Algae has been used as transportaion fuels by the airlines and automobile industry. Is it because drilling offshore and the Canadian Oil Sands is too expensive? Is it because electric cars are years away?