Laromi wrote:kublikhan » Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:03 am
..."Is a skeptical attitude healthy and the default position? Or are skeptics to be ridiculed and hounded with demands of proof it is a scam?"
The quid pro quo is of course that both sides negate the others advantage through lack of evidence ( that is procedural evidence which can be tried and tested producing similar results).
No, it's a pink unicorn argument. One side says for 23 years that they have an unicorn, the second wants the proof. Because you can't prove negative (it's logically impossible), and the proof wasn't delivered then the claims should move into the cryptozoology, in other word - pseudoscience.
However, that the notion LENR has some basis in fact by an ever increasing professional scientific audience tends to promote the hypothesis LENR has a place in physics, either by its own attributes or utilizing another hitherto unrecognised physic.
I keep it simple - cold fusion. I don't like to use LENR/LANR/CANR abbreviations because they are invented only to obtain patents while cold fusion would not since late 90s. That's why they are patenting their "devices" as chemical machines to get some kind of product. They are not patented as power/heat generators. And because it is possible to patent a non-working device under a nominal disguise then I think you can patent anything (and falsify conspiracy claims).
Cold fusion moved from fringe science to pseudoscience in early 1994, when Fleischmann was indeed defeated by other scientists who tried to test his hypothesis and the result was contrary to his belief. Since 1994 nothing scientifically new happened in that matter. Cold fusion however became a hot topic for CT nuts, new age believers, free energy crowd and other gullible folks. And we have people who really invest in rolling scam.
To my thinking, and based on evidence presented to and by this forum on that debate has the yea-Sayers well ahead.
What kind of evidence has been presented so far? Because all of it has been debunked so far. The main hypothesis - that there is any kind of nuclear reaction has been debunked because the equations are not working, and the excess heat production has never been proved. That's all.
First should be verified by gamma radiation which should occur as a normal effect of nuclear reaction. The problem occurs here. Nuclear reactions shown by Rossi are not working that way.
Second should be measured by calorimetry. I there is some kind of new physics then I would urge to measure the device by calorimetry not by thermocouples/thermometer. Calorimetry measures heat, and heat isn't temperature. I see that cold fusionists abhor calorimetry therefore nobody falsified that Hyperion/Ecat/other device isn't a thermos. Because it would be my first thing to do as a scientist to prove my work I have came to a conclusion that's a scam.
Sorry, but that kind of breakthrough would guarantee me a Nobel prize in both physics and chemistry.
To me, one can yell and scream as hard as one wants, threaten others with dastardly acts or just pretend to be an anal sphincter, unless you have a teensy-weensy-iddy-biddy-little-bit-of-proof
that something is not factual i.e. LENR in its concept or observed function is not, then you really have nothing except a lot of urine and flatus.
The observed function wasn't measured, we had a device plugged to electricity producing some vapor. I have that kind of device in my home, it's called electric kettle. To verify the claim all you need to do is test calorimetry, and Rossi/Defkalion/McKubre/others haven't produced a even a thin evidence in that matter.
Science isn't mystery it's a method.
PS. I concur SeaGypsy - these guys only happen to exist when they join cold fusion brigade.