LENR, Rossi and the ECAT Thread pt 2 (merged)

[Albert Ross]

Rossi refuses big Dick offer!
Says he finds it hard to swallow and he just won't bend.


February 14th, 2012 at 5:57 PM
Dick Smith Offer
Dear Andrea,
Australian millionaire Dick Smith has written an open letter to you offering more than $1,000,000 unconditionally if you can successfully repeat March 29 demo. This is easy money and you have till 20 Feb to accept. Kullander and Essen can be validators. This will provide you with easy and much needed funding. What good reason is there to decline this offer?
Yours Faithfully, Archibald Fields

Andrea Rossi

February 14th, 2012 at 6:23 PM
Dear Archibald Fields:
This is a Clownerie. If this guy wants to test a 1 MW plant and has 1 million to’ spend he can buy a 1 MW plant, with a refilar contract, that gives him all the necessary guarantee. Our plants Are tester by Our Customers and the Consultants they chiose. I have not time at all for this clownery.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

[Pops]

Just so the next version of "AlbertRoss" knows, you won't get in 19 posts next time.

[Laromi]

Not sure where the ( From:* Margot Egan [on behalf of Dick Smith]
*Sent:* Tuesday, 14 February 2012 12:51 PM
*To:* Andrea Rossi Re. E-CAT
*Subject:* from Dick Smith in Australia Re. U.S. One Million Dollars for
Successful Re-Testing of E-CAT

*To: Andrea Rossi**
From: Dick Smith*

Dear Mr Rossi

Re: USD1,000,000 for Successful Repeat of E-CAT Demonstration* ) e-mail was acquired from by Albert Ross, however if genuine, Andrea Rossi in his reply appears have challenged Tricky Dick to purchasing one of his 1MW units, well Dick, be big and purchase one of his confounded things to set the stage right,instead of big-noting. If your challenge to Rossi was successful by Rossi, you stood to loose USD$1M, purchasing a 1MW E-cat unit will either provide you a definite all up loss of USD$1M or a potential to make a few dollars over the next few years on the quantum of "free" energy provided through or by personal use of your own brand-spanking new E-cat. So what do you say Mr. Smith, gung ho I'll give it a go, or screw it, I'll be content big-noting?

[Quinny]

To Pops: I do not understand why Blinky or Albert have been banned. How have they broken COC.

To Laromi: I am more and more convinced that the whole Ecat thing is a scam. I cannot see why Rossi would refuse the 'challenge'.

[Cog]

The Blinky and Albert counter-point is not appreciated in some quarters. I find them extremely humorous although I doubt Carhole is laughing about it. The offer of Dick is pure internet comedy gold. A welcome relief from the blathering by the true believers on their multitude of free energy pump sites.

[SeaGypsy]

I wonder if the invoice from Leonardo to Byron New Energy is based on someone there gullible enough or someone there smart enough to get this invoice (with no real intent?).

From my understanding Dick Smith has a permanent offer of $200,000 standing for anyone who can show any amount of over unity energy device. In the 20 odd years he has done so, never once has had to pay out. Upping it to a million won't make any difference, he may as well say Rossi can have every cent.

[vision-master]

I AM RECEIVENG EMAILS REGARDING THE “MILLIONAIRE2 WHO OFFERS 1 MILLION FOR A TEST AND REGARDING WHAT WE THINK OF SOME WANNABE COMPETITORS WHO WILL MAKE OTHER TESTS ON A DEVICE OF THEM: I HAVE NOT TIME TO ANSWER SINGULARLY, SO HERE IS THE FINAL ANSWER:
1- MILLIONAIRE TEST: I AM THE CEO OF LEONARDO CORPORATION AND RECENTLY LEONARDO CORPORATION BECAME PROPERTY OF A TRUST OF INVESTORS TO WHOSE ATTORNEYS I HAVE TO ANSWER. THIS, COMBINED WITH THE FACT THAT OUR 1 MW PLANTS HAVE BEEN SOLD TO AN ENTITY THAT WANTS NOT TO BE DISCLOSED (WE ARE UNDER NDA) FORBIDS ME TO TAKE DECISIONS ABOUT THIS ISSUE WITHOUT THE PERMISSIONS OF THE ATTORNEYS; THE OPINION OF THEM IS THAT THIS STUNT IS NOT SERIOUS AND THAT OUR TECHNOLOGY DOES NOT TO BE PROVEN BY A STUNT, BUT BY A REGULAR OPERATION BY THE CUSTOMERS. WE HAVE TO WORK ON MANUFACTURING LINES TO MAKE RELIABLE AND ECONOMIC OUR PRODUCTS.
2- COMPETITORS: WE NEVER COMMENT ON OUR COMPETITORS, BUT STILL WE DO NOT SEE ANY COMPETITOR ON THE MARKET. WHEN WE WILL FIND PRODUCTS WHICH WILL COMPETE WITH OURS, THEN WE WILL HAVE COMPETITORS, BUT NOW IS NOT THE CASE. I AM ABSOLUTELY SURE THAT WITH OUR PRICES NOBODY WILL BE ABLE TO COMPETE, ALSO FOR THE NEW TECHNOLOGY WE HAVE DEVELOPED FOR THE E-CATS AND FOR THE PRODUCTION LINE WE ARE MAKING.
I WILL NOT ANSWER TO FURTHER QUESTIONS REGARDING THE MILLIONAIRE AND THE WANNABE COMPETITORS.
WARM REGARDS,
ANDREA ROSSI

http://www.e-catworld.com/2012/02/rossi ... investors/

[Cog]

Rossi loves those Large Caps doesn't he?

[vision-master]

No ones listens.........

[Schadenfreude]

I mean Rossi does not need the money....he has already collected plenty... http://newenergytimes.com/v2/sr/RossiEC ... Redact.pdf

It doesn't make any sense that this invoice is the real deal. The Byron New Energy Trust is the the one that Dick Smith and Ian Bryce are associated with. It is the Australian investor group that brought in Bryce to evaluate the validity of Rossi's device. So they would not have sent him any money given the high skepticism of he and Smith.

I don't know why Krivit posted it since it can't be for real. And if it WERE for real and money changed hands, then we would surely have heard about it from Dick Smith and Ian Bryce themselves.

[Schadenfreude]

Updated: Dick Smith Extends $1m Offer To Defkalion...and Defkalion Accepts

At least provisionally...

Defkalion Forum

Defkalion: So far we have not officially received (through a telephone, letter, fax or e-mail) any such offer published in different sites. If the offer and the “donor” are real, we will accept the challenge, performing a test under the protocol we have announced in our last Press Release (viewtopic.php?f=4&t=926&start=210).

In case this is a real proposal, we will accept an official letter and a proof of donated funds from a prime bank before any such testing.

Also note that our first independent official tests are starting on 24th of February 2012.

Cool!

ecatnews.com

February 16, 2012

Following Andrea Rossi’s refusal of Dick Smith’s $1m test offer, the Australian Businessman and skeptic has now extended that offer to Defkalion. While a cursory check has been made on his identity, care should be taken until it is confirmed by his office. The offer was made in answer to a question in the eCatNews comments section:

Dick Smith: No X prize but of course I would be happy to make a similar $1 million offer to Defkalion. It of course will be a waste of time as they are both clearly similar scams. Already Defkalion have announced that there will be delays in their “independent ” tests because the process ” of determining testing dates”. Will be “more time consuming than we thought”.

Ha ha. I could have predicted this delay while more investment capital is raised from the gullible.The independent tests will never happen. If they want to repeat the demo they gave Sterling Allan with a few simple protocols and they get a COP of at least 3 they can have the money. If they do agree they will then delay delay delay . I have seen it all before.

While Rossi’s refusal can be justified (in my opinion) by his claimed plan to mass manufacture the eCat, it will be a little harder to understand Defkalion doing the same. According to the company, it is conducting tests after inviting any credible body to visit and prove the Hyperion for themselves. They further state that the tester will then be free to publish their results.

This means that they have made the strategic decision to prove themselves. Here is a perfect opportunity to do just that. Recently, I have been impressed by DGT’s apparent professionalism, all the time aware that they have shown nothing of substance and certainly a lot less than Andrea Rossi.

If they refuse or obfuscate, I would have to finally agree with others and wonder why.

We need to see the offer in official form and then the future of Defkalion lies in what they do next. I hope they grab the opportunity with both hands.

[Alcassin]

The tests made by Defkalion are not real third-party tests. So we can say, that from the point of scientific method they are some kind of quiz. They have no scientific value, and moreover no calorimetry tests will be taken therefore the quiz seems pointless.

Third-party calorimetry tests are crucial because it is the only way, and really easy to prove that any excess heat is produced. Defkalion, as it looks like, is doing the same boondoggle which Rossi did.

Rossi moved from the point "the tests will prove" to "tests are clownery, we are selling the thing". In other words, he is moving from the hoax department to the fraud department. He's is going the same path as he was with petrodragon. I would also want to see the mythical robotized factory which is going to be built somewhere.

However, Carlhole is right in one thing (even broken clock is right twice a day), Krivit is also biased as he also believes in the thing working and therefore his source can't be treated as independent. Maybe there is some value in exposing Rossi, but not much else. Cold fusion claims haven't been proved for the last 23 years, and I'm not going to believe that this time is different.

[Cog]

If Rossi had suggested a robot factory capable of cranking out a 10,000 E-Cats a year, it might have been believeable but a million? Rossi isn't exactly like Apple. You can't exactly hide a factory complex of that size.

Bottom line is there is no factory complex, robot or otherwise.

[EnergyUnlimited]

"Rossi have made nuclear reactor in his cellar"
Yawn...
Not only a scam but also gone boring...
yawn...

[Schadenfreude]

Dick Smith ID Confirmed: Makes Offer To Defkalion CEO

February 17, 2012

I have now spoken to Dick Smith and confident as I can be that he and his offer are genuine.

As a skeptic he wears his colours honestly. I remain sceptical too but while I will hold on to hope until it is dashed, he is quite certain that this is a scam. Such a position is honourable and born from 30 years of seeing scam after scam giving off the same signals. He is not a pretend skeptic out to disprove something that is real. Anyone who has followed this site will know that I do not support such behaviour.

The length of the run should be short enough to satisfy Dick’s concern and long enough (and at a high enough COP) to exclude the possibility of any conventional chemical fuel. The idea is not to prove a nuclear process but that the Hyperion has a utility capable of doing the practical job claimed for it.

To satisfy the above, his testers will need to know the minimum volume they can inspect to and be allowed total access outside that black box (including before and after weights).

If that is done under the control of qualified and genuine skeptics then the test can be kept simple and reasonably short. I fully expect the company to carry on with the other tests they have already scheduled as it will give another dimension to our confidence in any successful result.

Dick posted the following in the comments section:

You heard it here first,. I have emailed the CEO of Defkalion extending the $1m offer providing a testing protocol can be agreed on. I have stated I only require a six hour test period and I am suspicious of their proposed 96 hour period as no person can remain awake that long! I have said I only require measurements of the input and output power and asked what COP they can achieve. I have also asked what their test input power would be. Obviously the type of power output and gain must be similar to what Rossi claimed.- not low output that is not commercially viable.

I will be away from my office until Tuesday so finalization of an agreement will have to wait until then. Interesting times!! I have also asked the date they would like to do the test.

[TheAntiDoomer]

"Rossi have made nuclear reactor in his cellar"
Yawn...
Not only a scam but also gone boring...
yawn...

Feel free not to click on or respond to this thread. It's a free world baby!

[Schadenfreude]

Below is a copy of our open announcement concerning Dick Smith, alsopublished on our website:

So far we have not officially received (through atelephone, letter, fax or e-mail) any such offer published in different sites.If the offer and the "donor" are real, we will accept the challenge,performing a test under the protocol we have announced in our last PressRelease (viewtopic.php?f=4&t=926&start=210).
In case this is a real proposal, we willaccept an official letter and a proof of donated funds from a prime bank beforeany such testing. Also note that our first independent official testsare starting on 24th of February 2012. No "donations" or any moneywhere required or offered for these independent tests.
DGT

Our online announcement was meant to initiate formal contact from Mr Smith.All subsequent communication was considered to remain private. Our aim hasnever been to gain publicity. Mr Smith apparently wants publicity (as witnessedby publishing our emails and getting others involved). First things first; MrSmith must first speak, discuss and agree with us. Publicity is later Mr Smith.

We declare that we do not have any spokes persons or representatives.All announcements, discussions and agreements are taken only by us.

Mr Smith’s first email to our CEO had no formal introduction, nor any professional courtesy:

On Fri, 17 Feb 2012 21:56:05 +1100, Dick Smith wrote:

Alex Dick smith here

My offer of $ 1 m for a successful demonstration of anLENR unit is confirmed subject to written agreement being signed.Please see the offer I made to Mr Rossi which is on ecat news site. My offer to you would be based on this. I only require a 6 hour testwith accurate measurements of the input and output power. Please advisethe input power you would like to test at and the COP you will be ableto demonstrate? I will not be able to do any paperwork until my officeis operating next Tuesday. When is the earliest you would like todo the test. ?

Rgds Dick Smith

Sent from my iPad

We requested for a Skype conference call with Mr Smith, similar to what he had requested from Mr Rossi. Mr Smith declined our offer. Strangely, when Mr Rossi declined Mr Smith, Mr Smith called Mr Rossi a scam. Should we consider the same of Mr Smith?

We look forward to receiving from Mr Smith (1) an official letter of his offer; (2) proof of dedicated funds from a prime bank for 1 million; and (3) proof of entity (corporate or personal). Upon receipt of the above, we are ready,willing and able to proceed with the challenge.

Our protocol has been accepted by leading world authorities and we are undergoing tests under strict NDAs. Nonetheless, we are open to discuss variations such as a 6 hour test, still being able to prove a COP of over 20. But these are formalities to be discussed in private. Should we proceed, Mr Smith will be bound by NDA. He can receive all the publicity he wants after the test.

Defkalion sounds awfully damn confident. This whole drama is now so well known throughout the world, the likelihood of an outright fraud is virtually zero. No way can Defkalion get away with ripping anyone off.

And if they truly do not possess the technology they claim, you have to wonder why they are doing what they are doing.

[NedLudd]

What part of BOLLOCKS do you not understand?
Ecat is BOLLOCKS
Rossi is BOLLOCKS
DEFKALION IS BOLLOCKS!

Dick Smith he is the man....
He is the DOG'S BOLLOCKS!

Stop The Green Widget Scams NOW!!

You heard it from Keef
(and he is the dog's bollocks too!)

[vision-master]

Blinky is back..............

[NedLudd]

Blinky?
Moi?