Donate Bitcoin

Donate Paypal


PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Phillipines accuses China of building airstrip on their reef

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 07:47:32

ImageImage
Image

Biden praises Stennis crew for maintaining South China Sea stability

ABOARD THE USS JOHN C. STENNIS — Vice President Joe Biden told the crew of the USS John C. Stennis aircraft carrier Thursday that the region and world depend on them to continue enforcing international norms and laws in the Pacific to maintain stability and prosperity. ...

“I’m told this is the first time an American vice president has ever been aboard one of our carriers at sea in the Western Pacific,” Biden told hundreds of crew members gathered in a hangar. “But I guarantee you, it will not be the last. We’re going to be present in the region, and we’re going to be active in the region — as long as all of you are alive.” ...

“There’s power in unity,” he said. “It shows all the other nations of the region that they don’t stand alone.”

Biden said there is no question that “our trilateral capacity … is now stronger than ever.”

“But advancing international norms involves more than just deterring threats,” he said. “It’s about upholding the liberal order that is critical to the success of all our nations.”

There are certain international “rules of the road” that cannot be allowed to fall to the wayside, he said.

“In the wake of this week’s arbitral tribunal ruling on the South China Sea, it’s essential that we continue to express our mutual support for the rule of law,” he said.

“You are either going to abide by international standards or not. Don’t pretend.”

http://www.stripes.com/news/biden-praises-stennis-crew-for-maintaining-south-china-sea-stability-1.419179#


Philippines' official hails South China Sea ruling a 'crowning glory'

A decision invalidating China's vast claims in the South China Sea was a "crowning glory" that renews faith in international law, the Philippines' top lawyer said on Friday, in Manila's strongest comment yet on its sweeping win.

The remarks by Solicitor General Jose Calida follow two days of carefully calibrated responses from the Philippines and are almost certain to irritate China further.

Manila has so far been keen not to rock the boat in the hope of starting dialogue toward Beijing allowing it to exercise what the Permanent Court of Arbitration in The Hague ruled were its sovereign maritime rights.

"It confirms that no one state can claim virtually an entire sea. The award is a historic win not only for the Philippines ... it renews humanity's faith in a rules based global order," Calida told a forum on the South China Sea.

"The award opens a horizon of possibilities for all stakeholders. The award is a crowning glory of international law."

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-southchinasea-ruling-idUSKCN0ZV06F


Random facts: of all the nations in the world, Filipinos have the highest approval rating of the US, 92% favorability. Which is about ten points higher than even Americans' opinion, of America. Also, the Philippines is the fourth largest source of immigration to the US.

For those that may not know, the Philippines was a US territory until granted independence in 1946.

Last edited by Sixstrings on Fri 15 Jul 2016, 08:33:54, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 08:22:21

Duterte would be right now getting severe lessons in realpolitik. His sympathies are with China, not the USA, though this is rarely mentioned as it remains to to be seen how he emerged from this schooling. His country is deeply conflicted about US relations, but is strongly anti Chinese. Duterte himself is a lunatic associate with extremist communist rebels & strong connection to the Moro by blood, this can all get very complicated. Duterte is the first non Tagalog President, a deal wild card.
SeaGypsy
Master Prognosticator
Master Prognosticator
 
Posts: 9284
Joined: Wed 04 Feb 2009, 04:00:00

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby dissident » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 10:00:41

Where was all the bitching at Japan for doing the exact same thing as China?

http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/east-asia ... uble-japan

Japan has built structures on uninhabited rocks 1,740 km from Tokyo to mark its territory – just like China has done in the South China Sea


Image

Image
dissident
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 6458
Joined: Sat 08 Apr 2006, 03:00:00

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby Cog » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 13:04:46

Is there any government hostile to the US interests that dissident doesn't fall in love with? I have yet to hear him speak of one.
User avatar
Cog
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 13416
Joined: Sat 17 May 2008, 03:00:00
Location: Northern Kekistan

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby ROCKMAN » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 13:31:29

Lots of interesting opinions. But back to reality: no law, regulation, govt policy, etc. really exists unless it's enforced. There were laws, policies, etc. that were violated in the Crimea, Egypt and the rest of a very long list. And none were enforced. Thus they did not really exist. Just as many today will prove to be non-existent in the future.
User avatar
ROCKMAN
Expert
Expert
 
Posts: 11397
Joined: Tue 27 May 2008, 03:00:00
Location: TEXAS

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 20:48:47

ROCKMAN wrote:Lots of interesting opinions. But back to reality: no law, regulation, govt policy, etc. really exists unless it's enforced. There were laws, policies, etc. that were violated in the Crimea, Egypt and the rest of a very long list. And none were enforced. Thus they did not really exist. Just as many today will prove to be non-existent in the future.


Yeah, but there are also reputational costs. It's just a matter of China hurting its relations with its neighbors, and with the rest of the world, and its standing in the world community.

China could go farther in the world, if it were more liked. That would be the SMART thing for them, actually. To be seen as a rising power that's going to take a seat at the table of responsible world leaders.

If they did that, then the world would actually look to them more. Trade with them, do more business, and China really would lead in the world.

Look how much China has done already -- investments around the world, and a lot in Australia. That's all because they were seen as being friendly.

If they go down another road, then they would be shunned more.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 21:21:47

An opinion piece from Russia:

From the Baltic to the South China Sea, Russia and China See One Foe — the U.S.

In order to better deal with a rising China, even an Asian-style NATO may eventually be in the cards. The U.S. has been vigorously strengthening its bilateral alliances and partnerships in the Asia-Pacific, expanding their reach and networking them into a U.S.-centered strategic web, with Japan, Australia and India assigned the role of the main regional bastions against China. ...

the Putin-Xi meeting was remarkable because of the unusually high level of thinly disguised anti-American rhetoric. In their joint communique, Russia and China reaffirmed “mutual support on key issues of sovereignty, security and development.”

They accused the U.S.-led West of undermining strategic stability while seeking “decisive military superiority,” and expressed their strong opposition to the U.S. missile defense buildup in Europe and Northeast Asia.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/artyom-lukin/russia-china-us_b_11014582.html


India getting more assertive about south china sea:

Image

India pledges to keep peace in South China Sea

PORT KLANG: An Indian navy commander has pledged to come to the aid of other countries in case of maritime security and disaster relief in the South China Sea.

Rear Admiral S V Bhokare, commander of India’s Eastern Fleet, said: “We want peace. We want to help other countries if they are in trouble. But if any countries want our help in maritime security and humanitarian relief, we will come forward.”

Adm Bhokare’s remarks were made while on a four-day port call here with a squadron of a guided-missile stealth frigate, Sahyadri and the guided missile corvette Kirch, as well as fleet tanker and support ship Shakti.

The three ships, and the frigate Satpura, are on their way home after taking part in the annual Malabar war games with the US and Japanese navies in the Pacific Ocean.

Asked about the rising tensions in the South China Sea arising from China’s maritime claims over the region, he said: “India is ready. When our ships sail out, it means we are ready to attack anyone who attacks us,” he replied.
http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/nation/2016/07/16/india-pledges-to-keep-peace-in-south-china-sea/


Australia:

Bishop surprised by Chinese's reaction to South China Sea ruling

Foreign Minister Julie Bishop is surprised China was upset by her remarks after an international court ruling on the South China Sea.

Australia's military will do what it has always done in the South China Sea and doesn't intend to be provocative, Julie Bishop says.

The foreign minister was surprised by China's angry reaction to her comments over an international court ruling on the South China Sea.

"I'm surprised that China would be surprised that I'm urging peace, restraint and abiding by international laws," she told ABC TV on Sunday, after China formally protested Australia's "wrong remarks".
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2016/07/17/bishop-surprised-chineses-reaction-south-china-sea-ruling


Ms Bishop urged all South China Sea claimants to resolve their disputes peacefully, saying Australia would keep exercising its international rights to freedom of navigation and overflight, and support the right of others to do the same.

She also told ABC radio on Wednesday that China's reputation would suffer as a result of the court ruling, insisting relations with the international community were crucial to its rise as a superpower.

"To ignore it would be a serious international transgression," she said. ...

In response to his comments, Ms Bishop issued a statement on Thursday night reiterating that Australia "continues to exercise its legal right of freedom of navigation and overflight," and supporting the right of other countries to do the same.

"Australia stands with the international community in calling for both sides to treat the arbitral ruling as final and binding," she said.

"Peace, stability and continued prosperity in East Asia requires the preservation of an order defined by rule of law for both great and smaller powers. Such an order is in the interests of all countries and has served the region remarkably well."

China claims much of the South China Sea, through which more than $US5 trillion ($A6.6 trillion) of trade moves annually. Brunei, Malaysia, the Philippines, Taiwan and Vietnam have rival claims.
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2016/07/14/china-takes-offence-bishops-comments?cx_navSource=related-side-cx#cxrecs_s


Image
Workers chat near a map of South China Sea on display at a maritime defence educational facility in Nanjing, showing the nine-dash line claiming most of the area for China.

South China Sea: Japan's Abe meets China's Li as maritime tensions flare

Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe and Chinese Premier Li Keqiang met on the sidelines of an international meeting in Mongolia as Asia's two largest economies try to repair a relationship fractured after Japan sided with the West in the South China Sea dispute.
http://www.smh.com.au/world/south-china-sea-japans-abe-meets-chinas-li-as-maritime-tensions-flare-20160716-gq74zz.html


Beijing blames Philippines for South China Sea trouble

Liu also said that the Philippines was to blame for "stirring up trouble", as he introduced a policy paper calling the islands in the strategic sea lane "China's inherent territory".
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/07/beijing-blames-philippines-south-china-sea-trouble-160713041125894.html


China should respect South China Sea ruling, says Philippines
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-36791281
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oil)

Unread postby Cid_Yama » Sun 17 Jul 2016, 22:42:17

Spratly Islands become military hotbed
by Cid_Yama » Mon Jan 28, 2008 10:43 pm

The Pentagon has chosen Guam, a quirkily American place that marries the beauty of Bali with the banality of Kmart, as the prime location in the western Pacific for projecting U.S. military muscle.

U.S. Marines by the thousands and U.S. tax dollars by the billions ($13 billion at last count) are to be dispatched to Guam over the next six years, along with a major-league military kit that includes Trident submarines, a ballistic missile task force, Navy Special Operations forces and Air Force F-22 fighter jets. Nuclear-powered attack submarines and B-2 stealth bombers have already arrived, and preparations are being made to accommodate aircraft carriers.

link


The fact that surrounding areas are rich in oil deposits has led to speculation that the Spratly Islands could be an untapped oil-bearing province located near some of the world's largest future energy consuming countries. Such speculation has given the Spratly Islands with great strategic value, and has fueled disputes over ownership.

One Chinese report estimates that there are 225 billion barrels oil equivalent of hydrocarbons in the Spratly Islands alone. If 70% of these hydrocarbons are gas, total gas resources (as opposed to proved reserves) would be almost 900 Tcf. If the rule-of-thumb for frontier areas were applied to these resource levels, the Chinese estimates would imply potential production levels for the Spratly Islands of almost 1.8 Tcf annually.

link

In 2005, China and the Phillipines signed a treaty to jointly develop the oil resources. Shortly after, the other South China Sea nations jumped on board, signing a treaty to jointly survey the oil resources of the region.

That locked out one major player, the US oil giants. You can guess how we got to where we are now.

This thread is about SOUTH CHINA SEA OIL ONLY. KEEP ALL DISCUSSIONS OF 'FREEDOM OF NAVIGATION' AND OTHER NONSENSE (like how horrible china is, or how great the US is) ON THE OTHER THREAD.
"For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst and provide for it." - Patrick Henry

The level of injustice and wrong you endure is directly determined by how much you quietly submit to. Even to the point of extinction.
User avatar
Cid_Yama
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 7169
Joined: Sun 27 May 2007, 03:00:00
Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby Cid_Yama » Sun 17 Jul 2016, 23:18:23

Basic Facts about the South China Sea Oil and Gas Reserves
The South China Sea covers a maritime area of 3.5 million square kilometers. The maritime area within China’s dotted line is just over 2 million square kilometers, of which shallow water area comprises 480,000 square kilometers, deep water area comprises 310,000 square kilometers and super deep area make up 1.22 million square kilometers. It has been proven that the South China Sea consists of 48 Mesozoic and Cenozoic sedimentary basins, of which the central and southern part of the South China Sea boasts 14 medium-large sedimentary basins with an area of 750,000 square kilometers. Results from a China Geological Survey study released in February 2011, show that the northern deep-water area of the South China Sea possesses relatively thick Mesozoic and Cenozoic sedimentary stratum. In sum, the area of sedimentary basin within China’s dotted line is 581,000 square kilometers with 350 proven oil and gas fields or tectonics. The central and southern part of the South China Sea, also the disputed area, has an area of 141.9 million square kilometers, occupying 71 percent of the area within China’s dotted line.

Data assessment by various parties concerning oil and gas reserves in the South China Sea diverges slightly due to a lack of adequate prospecting. According to some expert estimates from Hainan province, oil and gas reserves of the main basins in the South China Sea amount to 70.78 billion tons, of which petroleum deposits comprise 29.19 billion tons (with proven extractable deposits reaching up to 2 billion tons), natural gas deposits comprise 58 trillion cubic meters (with proven extractable deposits totaling 4 trillion cubic meters). Some oil company reports suggest that petroleum reserves from the central and austral part – also within China’s dotted line – amount to 25.53 billion tons, natural gas reserves total 2.085 billion cubic meters, and proven petroleum reserves are 4.2 billion tons and natural gas 580 million cubic meters. One study revealed that China’s neighbors have already identified oil and gas reserves in the South China Sea of 26.8 billion tons, of which petroleum reserves within China’s dotted line total 827 million tons and natural gas reserves amount to 4.0985 billion cubic meters.

The United States Geological Survey estimates that the proven and unproven petroleum reserves in the South China Sea are equivalent to 5 billion tons, with confirmed petroleum reserves amounting to no more than 1 billion tons. These estimates hold that 60 percent to 70 percent of the hydrocarbon in the South China Sea is natural gas. The “Oil and Gas Analysis Report on the South China Sea” released by the United States Energy Information Administration in February 2014 took an even more optimistic view. It estimated that the South China Sea contains approximately 11 billion barrels of oil and 190 trillion cubic feet of natural gas in proven and probable reserves, also claiming that the South China Sea is a potential source for hydrocarbons, particularly natural gas.

The geological census data of China’s Ministry of Land and Resources show that petroleum geological resources falling under China’s jurisdiction in the South China Sea equal roughly 23-30 billion tons and natural gas geological resources total 16 trillion cubic meters, making up one third of China’s total oil and gas resources, and equaling 12 percent of the world total. The petroleum reserves of Zengmu Basin, Sabah Basin and Wanan Basin, which fall roughly half within China’s claimed area, alone are close to 20 billion tons, being one of the remaining large-scale undeveloped oil reserves in the world.

Although various parties hold disparate estimates on the oil and gas reserves in the South China Sea, it is true that the South China Sea is endowed with great oil and gas resources, being one of the world’s four big oil and gas maritime areas. Because of this, the area garners the sustained attention of various countries worldwide and has become the focus of energy development and energy security.

link


All the while, Chinese President Xi Jinping has steadily consolidated the world's largest military coupled with roughly $356 billion in military spending power.


These waters have proven oil reserves of 7 billion barrels, and an estimated 900 trillion cubic feet of natural gas, according to Robert D. Kaplan, an author and the chief geopolitical analyst for Stratfor.

And if Chinese calculations are correct, then the South China Sea will ultimately yield 130 billion barrels of oil, which is second only to Saudi Arabia, making the South China Sea "the second Persian Gulf."

link


Now do you get it?
"For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst and provide for it." - Patrick Henry

The level of injustice and wrong you endure is directly determined by how much you quietly submit to. Even to the point of extinction.
User avatar
Cid_Yama
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 7169
Joined: Sun 27 May 2007, 03:00:00
Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby Sixstrings » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 06:18:37

Cid_Yama wrote:In 2005, China and the Phillipines signed a treaty to jointly develop the oil resources. Shortly after, the other South China Sea nations jumped on board, signing a treaty to jointly survey the oil resources of the region.


Some good info Cid, thanks for posting. What's the name of the treaty?

This thread is about SOUTH CHINA SEA OIL ONLY. KEEP ALL DISCUSSIONS OF 'FREEDOM OF NAVIGATION' AND OTHER NONSENSE (like how horrible china is, or how great the US is) ON THE OTHER THREAD.


Ok.
User avatar
Sixstrings
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 15160
Joined: Tue 08 Jul 2008, 03:00:00

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby Cog » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 06:23:55

One can not develop that which one does not own. The area is under dispute. The Chinese claim, of areas hundreds of miles south of their most southern province is ludicrous on its face. The Philippines and Vietnam have much stronger claims to the area based on geographic proximity.

This has already been arbitrated by a tribunal under the auspices of the UN Convention on the Laws of the Sea and China's claims were found invalid.

Regardless of what you think of US oil motives, our ability to freely navigate the world's seas will continue unabated by threats.
User avatar
Cog
Fusion
Fusion
 
Posts: 13416
Joined: Sat 17 May 2008, 03:00:00
Location: Northern Kekistan

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby AdamB » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 11:34:55

Cid_Yama wrote:In 2005, China and the Phillipines signed a treaty to jointly develop the oil resources. Shortly after, the other South China Sea nations jumped on board, signing a treaty to jointly survey the oil resources of the region.

That locked out one major player, the US oil giants. You can guess how we got to where we are now.


Sure. The chinese decided they didn't want to share with the other countries who have a better claim to the territory than they do. So they have decided to play hardball. China doesn't give a crap about US majors, except to steal their technology maybe.

Cid_Yama wrote:This thread is about SOUTH CHINA SEA OIL ONLY. KEEP ALL DISCUSSIONS OF 'FREEDOM OF NAVIGATION' AND OTHER NONSENSE (like how horrible china is, or how great the US is) ON THE OTHER THREAD.


Good thing the USGS says it isn't a Persian Gulf then, thereby eliminating this particular excuse for playing another round of "blame the US for everything because I'm not an original thinker to consider the real reasons".
Plant Thu 27 Jul 2023 "Personally I think the IEA is exactly right when they predict peak oil in the 2020s, especially because it matches my own predictions."

Plant Wed 11 Apr 2007 "I think Deffeyes might have nailed it, and we are just past the overall peak in oil production. (Thanksgiving 2005)"
User avatar
AdamB
Volunteer
Volunteer
 
Posts: 9290
Joined: Mon 28 Dec 2015, 17:10:26

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby AdamB » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 11:37:20

Cid_Yama wrote:And if Chinese calculations are correct, then the South China Sea will ultimately yield 130 billion barrels of oil, which is second only to Saudi Arabia, making the South China Sea "the second Persian Gulf."

link


Now do you get it?[/quote]

Yes. The USGS is a premiere geologic agency, the descendants of Hubbert himself, compared to those with only national interests in mind. Why would you choose inferior sources for your oil argument (obvious now, better numbers don't support your contention)?
Plant Thu 27 Jul 2023 "Personally I think the IEA is exactly right when they predict peak oil in the 2020s, especially because it matches my own predictions."

Plant Wed 11 Apr 2007 "I think Deffeyes might have nailed it, and we are just past the overall peak in oil production. (Thanksgiving 2005)"
User avatar
AdamB
Volunteer
Volunteer
 
Posts: 9290
Joined: Mon 28 Dec 2015, 17:10:26

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby efarmer » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 14:18:14

China estimates 105 Billion Barrels of petroleum in the South China Sea, USGS estimates 28 Billion.
China estimates Natural Gas equivalent to 225 Billion barrels of oil in the Spratly Island area.
In the entire South China Sea China estimates 2,000Tcf Natural Gas, USGS estimates 266Tcf.

It seems to me that this may not be about oil as much as about Natural Gas and that China may
be seeing the future in being sustainable based on Natural Gas instead of coal, which seems rather pragmatic. Malaysia has 80Tcf , Indonesia has 55Tcf are 135Tcf Total between them. It would seem that if China believes the region has 2000Tcf and the USGS believes it has 266Tcf, it sort of leads me to think the China really thinks the natural gas prize is in the Spratly Islands, and perhaps hence the immediacy of what would otherwise be a running diplomatic dispute.

Quality of life and environment has the US shifted from Coal, China will have to follow suit.
User avatar
efarmer
Intermediate Crude
Intermediate Crude
 
Posts: 2003
Joined: Fri 17 Mar 2006, 04:00:00

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby shortonoil » Mon 18 Jul 2016, 19:06:33

"with proven extractable deposits reaching up to 2 billion tons"

To put this into perspective that is 275 mb. Enough to power the world for 3 days. Or, the US for two weeks. $13 billion represents the the expenditure of 12 mb.

It might be cheaper to buy it from the Russians.
User avatar
shortonoil
False ETP Prophet
False ETP Prophet
 
Posts: 7132
Joined: Thu 02 Dec 2004, 04:00:00
Location: VA USA

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby Cid_Yama » Tue 19 Jul 2016, 05:07:14

21 Nov 2007

The Philippine President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo and Chinese Prime Minister Wen Jiabao met late yesterday to discuss the possible joint oil and gas development in the South China Sea, a statement from the presidential palace said today. Arroyo and Wen met on the sidelines of the 12th Association of Southeast Asian Nations' Summit in Singapore, the statement said. In 2005, China, the Philippines and Vietnam signed a cooperation agreement over the Spratly islands, a disputed archipelago in the South China Sea. Press Secretary Ignacio Bunye, who is also the presidential spokesman, said that Wen expressed hope "the three countries would continue the cooperation on the developmental level" now that seismic studies to determine the location and size of possible oil or natural gas deposits have been completed. Bunye said it is unclear when the joint exploration will take place and how each country will share the development of the potentially oil-rich Spratlys. Malaysia, Brunei and Taiwan also have territorial claims in the area. Source: Dow Jones

link


When President Arroyo succeeded Estrada in 2001, her administration set economic rejuvenation as its top priority. Manila looked to China, Asia’s fastest growing economy, as one of the key economic engines that could help pull the country out of its economic torpor. Arroyo was determined to prevent the Spratlys dispute from hindering the development of bilateral ties, especially the goal of strengthening two-way trade and investment. As the new century dawned, the economic relationship between the two countries was at last beginning to show promise, mainly due to China’s thirst for imported raw materials and other commodities. In 2000, the value of two-way trade stood at US$3.3 billion; by 2005, it had risen to $17.6 billion, an increase of 433 percent (China Daily, January 16). In 2005, the PRC was the Philippines’ fourth-largest trade partner (after the United States, Japan and the European Union) up from 12th place in 2001 (Philippines National Statistics Office, June). Notably, the Philippines enjoys a healthy trade surplus with the PRC, amounting to an astonishing $8.1 billion in 2005 (Philippine Star, June 1). The PRC has also stepped up aid and investment to the Philippines in recent years. During Hu’s visit, China agreed to invest $1.1 billion in the Philippines (including $950 million in a nickel mining plant in the economically depressed Mindanao region). It also agreed to provide a $542 million concessional loan for the upgrade of the North Luzon railway project from Manila to the Clark Special Economic Zone, plus an additional $2.5 million in grants (Philippine Star, April 28, 2005). Since Hu’s visit, several large delegations of Chinese businessmen have passed through the Philippines and have shown a keen interest in investing in infrastructure projects, agriculture and fisheries, mining and offshore oil fields. The two sides have set an annual target of $30 billion in bilateral trade by 2010. Given the extraordinary annual growth rate of 40 percent, this target seems quite realistic.

The second factor behind improved relations has been the potential breakthrough in the Spratlys dispute. As part of China’s charm offensive toward the Southeast Asian region, Beijing has sought to reassure the ASEAN countries that its growing power does not pose a threat to regional stability. China wants to demonstrate that its behavior in the Spratlys dispute is a “litmus test” of its benign intentions toward Southeast Asia. As a result, in 2002 China and ASEAN signed the Declaration on the Conduct of Parties in the South China Sea (DoC) which aimed to freeze the status quo and encouraged the disputants to pursue confidence-building measures (CBMs) to ease tensions. The DoC paved the way for a landmark agreement between state-owned energy companies Philippine National Oil Company (PNOC) and China National Offshore Oil Company (CNOOC) to conduct joint seismic studies in the disputed waters of the South China Sea to assess the extent of the oil and gas deposits in the area. The agreement—known as the Joint Marine Seismic Undertaking (JMSU)—was signed in September 2004 during a state visit to the PRC by President Arroyo. Manila has characterized the JMSU as “marine scientific research,” one of the CBMs outlined in the DoC. In March 2005, after initially condemning the agreement, Vietnam’s PetroVietnam joined the JMSU as well. The three parties have stressed, however, that the three-year JMSU is a commercial agreement only, that it will not involve any drilling and that it does not change the sovereignty claims of the three countries involved. Nevertheless, Arroyo hailed the JMSU as a “historic diplomatic breakthrough for peace and security in the region,” while China lauded the agreement as the first step toward implementing Deng Xiaoping’s 1988 proposal to shelve the sovereignty dispute in favor of the joint exploration and extraction of resources.

link


Arroyo's withdrawal of Phillipine troops in Iraq in 2004 and her turn towards China, Including talk of a joint defense treaty with China, angered the Bush Administration who then set out to destroy her.

US intelligence created false evidence of corruption and the US hand-picked successor as President, Benigno Aquino III, had her jailed on false charges.

Aquino immediately reversed course with China.

The Phillipine Supreme Court has just released Arroyo after 5 years, with an apology, saying there was no evidence of corruption.

Duterte, the new president (as of June 30, 2016), was a political ally of Arroyo.

Duterte has already signaled a return to Arroyo's policies and pivot to China.

Western Media is already attacking him.

So, much of what you are reading in the Western Media about protecting the Phillipines from China, and protecting Phillipine sovereignty, is nonsense.

We know Duterte is embracing China. And we're trying to throw a wrench into it.

The case before the ICJ regarding Maritime borders was brought by US lapdog Aquino. Duterte is already trying to mend fences with China.
"For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst and provide for it." - Patrick Henry

The level of injustice and wrong you endure is directly determined by how much you quietly submit to. Even to the point of extinction.
User avatar
Cid_Yama
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 7169
Joined: Sun 27 May 2007, 03:00:00
Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby AdamB » Tue 19 Jul 2016, 14:57:45

You said it was about oil, and only oil.

Then you reel off a spasm of geopolitical arm waving that has nothing to do with oil.

How about we discuss exactly what you said you wanted to discuss? That the small amounts of oil quantified by the descendants of Hubbert himself aren't enough to justify ANY of the random assemblage of black/purple/green swans to cause some event any more worse than the run of the mill stuff we've had going on for decades now?

Other than this happens to be your particular favorite in the role playing league of the doomer fantasy league?
Plant Thu 27 Jul 2023 "Personally I think the IEA is exactly right when they predict peak oil in the 2020s, especially because it matches my own predictions."

Plant Wed 11 Apr 2007 "I think Deffeyes might have nailed it, and we are just past the overall peak in oil production. (Thanksgiving 2005)"
User avatar
AdamB
Volunteer
Volunteer
 
Posts: 9290
Joined: Mon 28 Dec 2015, 17:10:26

Re: The Spratly Islands - Before the Nonsense (It's about oi

Unread postby Cid_Yama » Tue 19 Jul 2016, 23:47:00

Since China did the seismic survey, they surely know better than you or the USGS. (Who hasn't)

It does not matter what you or the USGS proclaim, only what China believes.
(And I don't believe the USGS actually believes what they are saying.)

And the bit about wanting to 'contain China' is nonsense. This is about the oil and US oil companies chomping at the bit to get in there.

Duterte is planning for the joint development of the oil resources using China's dime. Both China and the Phillipines win. They were already on that road during the Arroyo Administration.

Duterte has no intention of letting the US muscle it's way back in. He knows the score.

No matter how many times you repeat your nonsense, it isn't any more true than the first time you said it. It IS about the oil. We could care less, if not for the oil. It's always been about the oil. Nothing else could justify the expense we are incurring.

Duterte has only been in office a little over two weeks, and is already putting it all into motion.

All our efforts to drive a wedge between China and the Phillipines will come to nought.

You remind me of Sixstrings, you can't see beyond the US rhetoric anymore than he can.
"For my part, whatever anguish of spirit it may cost, I am willing to know the whole truth; to know the worst and provide for it." - Patrick Henry

The level of injustice and wrong you endure is directly determined by how much you quietly submit to. Even to the point of extinction.
User avatar
Cid_Yama
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 7169
Joined: Sun 27 May 2007, 03:00:00
Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian

Re: China issues warning to US ahead of South China Sea ruli

Unread postby AgentR11 » Thu 28 Jul 2016, 11:45:46

Just to disabuse six of the idea that China is alone in the SCS..

Russia and China to conduct joint exercise in SCS in September.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-south ... SKCN1080O8

Most particularly of note:
Yang(PRC defense ministry spokesman) said China and Russia were comprehensive strategic partners and had already held many exercises this year...
"These drills deepen mutual trust and expand cooperation, raise the ability to jointly deal with security threats,


Again, the one thing we had to do, the one and only thing we needed to ensure is that Russia and China never trust each other. And its the one thing, the sole tangible thing, we have accomplished in our response to Russia since 2014. We gave China an opportunity to prove no hostile intent, and they took it straight to the bank. Won't be a dang thing we can do this entire century to split them apart again.

So... the US went from agrarian backwater to industrial and technological superpower in a century with a couple hundred million folks, cheap energy, and devotion to capitalism. China+Russia? 1500 million folks with cheap'ish energy, and several hundred million of those that believe in capitalism like a fundamentalist Christian believes in the bible.

In two years, we solved China's problems for a century and gave our only possible global competitor the only tool they lacked to go head to head with us.

staggering level of incompetence.
all over someone's bruised ego.
Yes we are, as we are,
And so shall we remain,
Until the end.
AgentR11
Light Sweet Crude
Light Sweet Crude
 
Posts: 6341
Joined: Tue 22 Mar 2011, 09:15:51
Location: East Texas

Philippines Charges FF Companies for Violating Human Rights

Unread postby dohboi » Thu 28 Jul 2016, 16:16:08

https://www.theguardian.com/environment ... ights-case

World's largest carbon producers face landmark human rights case

Filipino government body gives 47 ‘carbon majors’ 45 days to respond to allegations of human rights violations resulting from climate change


The world’s largest oil, coal, cement and mining companies have been given 45 days to respond to a complaint that their greenhouse gas emissions have violated the human rights of millions of people living in the Phillippines.

In a potential landmark legal case, the Commission on Human Rights of the Philippines (CHR), a constitutional body with the power to investigate human rights violations, has sent 47 “carbon majors” including Shell, BP, Chevron, BHP Billiton and Anglo American, a 60-page document accusing them of breaching people’s fundamental rights to “life, food, water, sanitation, adequate housing, and to self determination”.

The move is the first step in what is expected to be an official investigation of the companies by the CHR, and the first of its kind in the world to be launched by a government body.

The complaint argues that the 47 companies should be held accountable for the effects of their greenhouse gas emissions in the Philippines and demands that they explain how human rights violations resulting from climate change will be “eliminated, remedied and prevented”.

It calls for an official investigation into the human rights implications of climate change and ocean acidification and whether the investor-owned “carbon majors” are in breach of their responsibilities...
User avatar
dohboi
Harmless Drudge
Harmless Drudge
 
Posts: 19990
Joined: Mon 05 Dec 2005, 04:00:00

PreviousNext

Return to Asia Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests