Natural Gas Vehicles

[pstarr]

No dipshit, Honda is not out of business. The compressor is out of business.

Dude, do you actually READ what you wrote a second time before hitting the "submit" button?

You really should. Then it wouldn't seem like you trying to correct yet another monstrous goof.

A link reporting the demise of the Honda home compressor business, not coincidently including the same pix that Xeno posts

Since Honda started offering a natural gas-powered version of the Civic (the GX) several years ago they have also offered buyers a device called the Phill. Phill is a home natural gas compressor that hooks up to the household gas supply and fuels the car. The device is built by a Honda-owned company called FuelMaker Corp in Toronto. Honda has now sold FuelMaker to Clean Energy Fuels Corp. for $17 million.

And Clean Energy Fuels Corp. has abandoned said home compressor system

Honda and FuelMaker were unable to complete their end of a purchase agreement with Clean Energy Fuels Corp., a natural gas fuel company co-founded by oil billionaire-turned-CNG-booster T. Boone Pickens, and the deal was terminated Wednesday.

Then finally Fuelmaker, the company that actually manufactured the PHILL compressed natural gas filling stations for Honda was driven into involuntary bankruptcy.

Honda no longer sells, supports, or owns a natural gas compressor system. None exist.


So, you see you are wrong. But I explained this to you several times. But you must be an idiot? You know this is not a waste time because I get a perverse pleasure humiliating you But really. Is something wrong with you, Xeno? Why do you keep changing you names here? And having your post deleted by the mods. Are you an undercover douchebag?

[Xenophobe]

So, you see you are wrong.

Nope. Just posted a pic showing the CNG powered car and a link showing where you can buy one. While your strawman is amusing, it certainly doesn't have anything to do with the point I was trying to make, and which you enthusiastically avoid.

You can go get a CNG powered car by Honda. And you can fuel it at home. And yet another means of commuting not requiring crude based fuels works out just fine for the average American.

Really tears you up, all these solutions just laying around, waiting to be utilized, don't it?

Are you an undercover douchebag?

Coming from someone who doesn't know the difference between USGS undiscovered resource volumes and IHS recovery factor diagrams, that is absolutely hysterical. Read up on the difference at Wiki yet?

[pstarr]

You can go get a CNG powered car by Honda. And you can fuel it at home.

You could with your boviation and hot air

[OilFinder2]

Here's a video I found of a guy filling up his Civic GX at a CNG station in Oklahoma:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RycTyw6VDNs

It's just like filling your car up with gasoline!

[vaseline2008]

I'm interested to know if these cars can also run on methane since NG is mostly methany anyways. Anyone know?

Yes they can. http://www.truehealth.org/methane.html

Hmmm, now if we could only obtain all that methane under the ocean...

[sparky]

.
Gas fuelled vehicles have a long and distinguished history ,
like batteries operated industrial vehicle , they have been around for decades
and are competitive in some applications less in others
gas operated vehicles have some great advantages

-the tech is mature and proven ,

-distribution infrastructures and fleet can be retrofitted at a trivial cost

-the performances are acceptable globally and even superior for some
( better cold start , less hostile on the lubricants much less pollution )

-a wide variety of sources can be used including renewable ones

It certainly the most attractive option after petrol or diesel

[TheDude]

Here's a video I found of a guy filling up his Civic GX at a CNG station in Oklahoma:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RycTyw6VDNs

It's just like filling your car up with gasoline!

You new around here?



EIA has obfuscated their AFV data; used to able to click and straightaway see how much CNG or E85 cars were in use in the 90s. For CNG it wobbled around a lot, like it was a fad with fleets that came and went upon whim of budget or mandate.

IANGV says US CNGs are flat at 110k for 2009; so much for your Plan, Pickens. At 0.06% of total fleet US is #41 worldwide for adopting CNG.

They're nuts about it in Pakistan, 60.50% of fleet for 2009, although that's the 2009 number for CNG vehicles divided by the 2005 number for fleet size, thus a bit misleading. 2005-2009 they were consuming oil thus: 336.19 357.08 377 396 373.27. Gas+Dist = ca. 36 kb/d. Real earthshaking stuff here.

[sparky]

.
beside moving fat butts in commuter cars , transport also has some use in the real world
gas can do it ,no others

http://www.goauto.com.au/mellor/mellor. ... DD0021DF1E

[JRP3]

How much energy is required to pressurize and cool NG into LNG?

[sparky]

.
well there is the compression and then there is the refrigeration plant , over all probably 500Kw
for 60 T per day , or about 1.3 bucks per tonne

rough estimate

[kildred590]

the tech is mature and proven ,

? So is steam power.

distribution infrastructures and fleet can be retrofitted at a trivial cost

Affordable cost, yes, but certainly not trivial.

-the performances are acceptable globally and even superior for some
( better cold start , less hostile on the lubricants much less pollution )

Performance is considerably worse than diesel.
As is the lifespan of the injectors, since diesel is partially lubricating.

a wide variety of sources can be used including renewable ones

But they're all very expensive (the renewable type).

t certainly the most attractive option after petrol or diesel

Nah, LPG is. It doesn't require anywhere near as much compression and is a lot more efficient.

The cost of running a fleet of trucks on CNG instead of diesel is substantial. It's like more than twice as expensive. The cost of oil would have to rise a great deal to make it feasible, and the economy would be shattered long before you recahed that point.

[sparky]

.

You are right about LPG being even better
I somehow confused the two

[TimH]

I'm wondering why UPS would go the LNG way? I mean if it cost more to run their trucks on LNG then of course the bottom line is effected.The article implies UPS is going with LNG for environmental reasons but still a business such as UPS that uses so much fuel, this would seem to be to big an expense.What am I missing?

http://tinyurl.com/48bsyhv

[Keith_McClary]

Greenest Vehicles of 2011 - REVISED 2/16/12 (sic)
#1 is: HONDA CIVIC GX c 1.8L 4, auto [CNG]

[JRP3]

Greenest Vehicles of 2011 - REVISED 2/16/12 (sic)
#1 is: HONDA CIVIC GX c 1.8L 4, auto [CNG]

Same score as the LEAF on the grid average, if NG were used in generating plants to replace coal plants the LEAF would win.

[Ludi]

Same score as the LEAF on the grid average, if NG were used in generating plants to replace coal plants the LEAF would win.

"And if my grandmother had wheels she'd be a wagon."

[JRP3]

Er, no, she'd still be your grandmother, with a set of wheels. The point was that burning NG in a generating plant is more efficient than burning it in inefficient ICE's. Places like the UK with a lower percentage of coal use would probably have the LEAF at the top of that list.

[OilFinder2]

LINK

Westport signs agreement with GM to develop natural gas engines
ABR Staff Writer
Published 29 June 2011

Westport Innovations, a provider of alternative fuel, low-emissions transportation technologies, has signed an agreement with General Motors (GM) to develop advanced natural gas engine controls, emissions and performance strategies for light-duty vehicles.

Westport is planning to open a new technical center in Michigan, US the company currently employs 15 people in Farmington Hills, Michigan, and plans to add more people and invest in facilities as demand for natural gas-powered, alternative-fuel vehicles.

Westport president of light-duty division Ian Scott said the company is excited to work with GM and invest in advanced natural gas technology for the automotive market.

[...]

[pstarr]

LINK

Westport signs agreement with GM to develop natural gas engines
ABR Staff Writer
Published 29 June 2011

Westport Innovations, a provider of alternative fuel, low-emissions transportation technologies, has signed an agreement with General Motors (GM) to develop advanced natural gas engine controls, emissions and performance strategies for light-duty vehicles.

Westport is planning to open a new technical center in Michigan, US the company currently employs 15 people in Farmington Hills, Michigan, and plans to add more people and invest in facilities as demand for natural gas-powered, alternative-fuel vehicles.

Westport president of light-duty division Ian Scott said the company is excited to work with GM and invest in advanced natural gas technology for the automotive market.

[...]

What a joke. No one needs to develop a natural gas engine. Same ICE, different timing. The issue is not the mechanics of the power train, the real problem is the impossibility of delivering a gas to places that don't have natural gas pipelines. Like interstates, farms, timberlands, mine sites, container ships. The real issue is compressing decompressing and recompressing a gas. EROEI. Do you know what that is, Oily?

God! Stop your obfuscation, already.

[TheAntiDoomer]

and these are just the main lines, there are literally thousands of smaller arteries going to just about every town i america, what is the problem again?