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MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

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MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 16:06:08

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BREAKING NEWS: Turkish military launch attempted coup to depose government as gunfire and low flying jets heard over Ankara

Fast attack jets and helicopters were heard above Ankara and Istanbul after the military confirmed they had seized control of the country. Istanbul's Bosphorus Bridge and Fatih Sultan Mehmet Bridge were both closed after the military deployed roadblocks.
Tracer fire from Turkish military helicopters was spotted over Ankara.

In a statement sent by email and reported on Turkish TV channels, the military said all of Turkey's existing foreign relations would be maintained and that the rule of law would remain the priority. According to the military tonight's action will 'reinstall the constitutional order, democracy, human rights and freedoms, to ensure that the rule of law once again reigns in the country, for the law and order to be reinstated'.

The military statement went on to say that 'all international agreements and commitments will remain. We pledge that good relations with all world countries will continue'. Troops have rounded up police officers loyal to the government, according to witnesses. CNN Turkey showed two military vehicles and a group of soldiers lined up at the entrance of one of the bridges in Turkey's biggest city.

A Turkish official who did not want to be named said soldiers had been deployed in other cities in Turkey, but did not specify which ones. Dogan News Agency reported the national police directorate summoned all police to duty in Ankara. Turkish fighter jets have been reported over Ankara.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3692693/Turkish-military-launch-attempted-coup-depose-government.html


'We have taken control': Turkish military launch coup to depose Islamist government of Recep Erdogan as troops round up police, attack the capital, seize all airports and put tanks on the streets

The Turkish military has announced it has taken control and overthrown the government of Recep Erdogan as troops round up police and attack the capital Ankara. ...

US Secretary of State John Kerry said he hoped the crisis in Turkey would soon be resolved while preserving peace, stability and a respect for 'continuity'.

Turkey's top general has been taken hostage at the military headquarters in the capital Ankara after an attempt to bring down the government, the state-run Anadolu news agency reported.

'General Hulusi Akar has been taken hostage by a group in the military who attempted an uprising.'

Troops have rounded up police officers loyal to the government, according to witnesses.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3692693/Turkish-military-launch-attempted-coup-depose-government.html


In the skies of Ankara fighter jets flying low Turkey COUP ATTEMPT
https://youtu.be/YgUCkq-UkGc


Army forces control bridges, airports and public radio broadcast
https://youtu.be/orTsIwQYqSU


Tanks in turkey after the coup
https://youtu.be/CxKf2cl7LFU
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby GHung » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 16:40:46

Well chit. Some folks have all the fun.

Grab yer pitchforks fellas!
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:09:43

GHung wrote:Well chit. Some folks have all the fun.

Grab yer pitchforks fellas!


Well we'll see what happens, whether more of the people support the secular military, or if Erdogan's supporters take to the streets (he's been calling for people to come out to support his government).

Hopefully things are peaceful and it doesn't devolve into any kind of civil war and mass turmoil.

My own opinion: I'm not an expert about Turkey, but generally..

* Turkey has a history of coups before, in years past.

* Per CNN, the military sees themselves as the safeguards of secular control whenever the government gets out of hand.

* Generally, what's been going on during the Erdogan years is that he appealed to hardline conservative muslim voters in Turkey, and he dragged the country more islamist. Which was very unpopular with Turks that wanted to keep the country secular. (turkey has a tradition of being more secular, than anything fundy muslim)

* Erdogan is unpopular recently, because he had a history of helping / enabled ISIS, and now with terrorism out of control in Turkey, many blame Erdogan. Which is one of the reasons the military has launched the coup to depose the Erdogan government.

Latest news is that the mayor of Ankara is in Erdogan's ruling party, and he's called for government supporters to take to the streets. But so far the streets are quiet.

There are some reports of clashes between government-loyal police, and the Turkish military.

Erdogan has been a very authoritarian dictator strongman Putin type.

Turkish politics is complicated.. and then there's all the problems with the kurdish party / Erdogan brutally suppressing them at times.

Skynews reports that Erdogan is "enormously divisive," the people are divided and either love him or loathe him.

I think my sympathies would lean with the secular side, since Erdogan has been taking the country more islamist -- and it ain't like the world needs more of that.

Turkey is traditionally secular.. the world needs more secular moderate islam, less hardliner fundy.. the people that would be backing the military, want Turkey to get back to a more a western secular direction.

Some latest news.. tanks surrounding the parliament, reports of fighting.. and there was a large explosion at the state tv HQ.

It's unclear as yet where this is headed. Government has the police and special forces loyal to it, versus the national military. The military placed the Erdogan-appointed top general under house arrest.

Erdogan supporters are saying "you can't destroy democracy in the name of freedom," while opponents are saying they can't stand his autocratic despotic rule anymore.
Last edited by Sixstrings on Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:22:17, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby dolanbaker » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:22:06

There are a number of reports of gunfire in Ankara and possible civilian casualties.
Ronald Coase, Nobel Economic Sciences, said in 1991 “If we torture the data long enough, it will confess.”
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby GASMON » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:29:42

It's World war 3 Jim, but not as we know it.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:34:55

dolanbaker wrote:There are a number of reports of gunfire in Ankara and possible civilian casualties.


It's certainly said, hopefully Turkey doesn't devolve into full on civil war / chaos / war all over it. Which the rest of NATO certainly can't be having.. so that's a very sticky situation.

Western governments are torn -- they know Erdogan has been becoming ever more of an authoritarian dictator, yet how can the West support democracy being overthrown? And most of all, the West doesn't want civil war and full on chaos in Turkey.

I was watching CNN, some reporting on there.. the run-up to this thing was that Erdogan made a move to gather even more power to the presidency. His PM opposed it. Then Erdogan pushed out the prime minister.

So it's a situation where this is a military coup in a democratic country.. yet the president of that country has been turning it into a dictatorship.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:41:20

I visited Turkey about 3 years ago. The Turks I met were mostly well-educated and western-leaning. They despised the increasing Islamization of Turkey under Erdogan. They fearedthe growing influence of Islam in Turkey and they hated seeing overt signs of Islam...like the growing numbers of women wearing Burkhas on the streets of Istanbul---the Turks I met wanted Turkey to be a modern, western leaning country.

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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Cog » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:46:06

I support this coup.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:48:49

Very sad, on CNN now they're showing Erdogan supporting civilians confronting the military and the military firing, some civilians hit.

An analyst on CNN was just saying that Erdogan created a situation where the people either love him, or loathe him, and that "unfortunately there's no peaceful way for Turkey to find its way out of this" other than these two sides fighting it out.

Note: I'm not saying I agree with this, I'm just saying what the analyst said on CNN just now.

It's a bad situation, the analyst said Turkey is a country that usually has no history of the military firing on civilians. So it must be bad, for it to come to this.

Erdogan's government has lost support of the military institution; and so they called for these civilians to take to the streets, that was irresponsible.

It's a democracy -- but yet Erdogan was making it not a democracy, he was making it a dictatorship.
Last edited by Sixstrings on Fri 15 Jul 2016, 18:05:00, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Subjectivist » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 17:58:52

GASMON wrote:It's World war 3 Jim, but not as we know it.

Gas


Hey when Did Dr. Demento make it to the UK?
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 18:08:02

There is nothing bad about it 6 sound like you would rather he was installed as Dictator for Life, as he was clearly aiming.

Makes perfect sense really, yesterday 1 scumbag proved exactly how evil Salafism is, today Salafism loses it's most powerful head of State. Poetic.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 18:43:05

SeaGypsy wrote:There is nothing bad about it 6 sound like you would rather he was installed as Dictator for Life, as he was clearly aiming.


Oh goodness no, I said it many times before, about these brewing problems with Erdogan and how he's been making Turkey ever more a dictatorship and fundy muslim when Turkey was never meant to be like that, since the days of Attaturk.

Attaturk is the one that gave the military the charter to ensure the country never be fundy muslim controlled, and that it remain secular.

I was just watching CNN, and they were saying that it's actually *in the Turkish constitution* that the military has the ultimate authority there to make sure the place stays secular and western.

What's been going on is Erdogan's been chipping away at that.. making it ever more fundy muslim. He recently jailed some Turkish military leaders, and weakening the power of the military.

As we all know, Erdogan -- FOR YEARS now -- has been chipping away at democracy in general, seizing all powers to himself, making Turkey a dictatorship. And then Erdogan's got his fundamentalist muslim base to back him up.

It's sad, Turkey was not supposed to be like that.. per the father of the country, Attaturk.

What's also SAD though -- and a big national security problem -- is if this developed into a full on civil war.

What the RIGHT thing to do, YEARS AGO, would have been for EU and US governments to have already stepped in about Erdogan. The man has been driving out secular western values, from Turkey, which is the LAST thing Europe should be for.

LATEST NEWS --

On CNN, one of Erdogan's senior advisers says this is a coup from a "faction" in the military, but not the whole military. Just to note, Turkey has the 2nd largest military in NATO. CNN also reported that one of the fighter jets over Ankara was pro Erdogan, and shot down a pro coup helicopter.

It's unclear where this thing is going, right now.

Maybe it will be a failed coup -- Obama administration has just announced support for the Erdogan government:

Obama and Kerry Back Turkish Government

“The president and secretary agreed that all parties in Turkey should support the democratically-elected government of Turkey, show restraint, and avoid any violence or bloodshed,” the statement read. “The secretary underscored that the State Department will continue to focus on the safety and security of U.S. citizens in Turkey.
http://www.nytimes.com/live/turkey-coup-erdogan/obama-and-kerry/
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 19:01:44

My bet is it won't fail. Let's see. It's been about 4 hours, it is a few hours until dawn.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby GHung » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 19:13:18

.... But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.....

....or something like that. Could go either way.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 20:40:06

Erdogan says the coup plotters were taking their orders from an Erdogan opposition cleric in Pennsylvania:
Turkey coup: Pennsylvania cleric is Erdogan foe

Turkish government lawyer: US cleric had 'unlawful conduct'
SCRANTON — As government officials and military forces clash in the streets of Ankara and elsewhere in Turkey, attention has turned to a reclusive Muslim cleric in Pennsylvania whom Turkey's president has long accused of orchestrating coup attempts.

"(S)uspicion has fallen on Fethullah Gulen, a US..-based Turkish religious scholar and political enemy of Recep Tayyip Erdogan, the strongman Turkish president," writes Steve LeVine at qz.com.

"Until now, Erdogan had appeared to have crushed the 75-year-old Gulen, who has deep roots in the Turkish political, military, judicial, and media establishments, as well as in Muslim countries around the world.

But if, as Erdogan himself has alleged, Gulen or his followers are involved in the putsch, then it demonstrates that he remains a force to contend with, though he has lived for years in seclusion in Saylorsburg, Pennsylvania."


The Turkish uprising comes just two weeks after a lawyer representing the Turkish government vowed to continue exposing what he calls the "unlawful conduct" of Gulen. Robert Amsterdam released a statement on June 30, one day after a federal judge in Scranton dismissed his lawsuit against Gulen. ...

The suit contended Gulen ordered sympathetic police, prosecutors and judges in Turkey to target members of a rival spiritual movement critical of his teachings. The legal action was filed as part of a crackdown on the Turkish cleric and his followers by Erdogan. ...

U.S. District Judge Robert Mariani threw out the suit, ruling the claims did not belong in U.S. courts.
Gulen's attorneys had called the legal action an attempt by Erdogan to silence Gulen, who has criticized the Turkish leader.

Gulen has lived in self-imposed exile in the United States since 1999, according to Time magazine. "Despite his distance, he remains one of the most influential people in Turkey," the magazine writes online. "From afar, he has run a powerful movement calling for a secular and democratic government."

Erdogan has launched a broad campaign against Gulen's movement in Turkey and abroad. The Erdogan regime has carried out a purge of civil servants suspected of ties to the movement, seized businesses and closed some media organizations. Gulen has been charged criminally with plotting to overthrow the government, and was placed on trial in absentia in Turkey earlier this year.
http://www.ydr.com/story/news/2016/07/15/turkey-coup-pennsylvania-cleric-erdogan-foe/87158206/


The group appears to be pro democratic and in favor of secular moderate government, but I don't know enough to conclude that. But anyway, they deny they had any involvement in this:
Gulen's nonprofit, the Alliance for Shared Values, denies any involvement and has condemned "any military intervention in domestic politics of Turkey."
In a 2014 profile, The Times described Gulen's faith and politics, which include a blend of Islamic piety and Sufi mysticism as well as support for free markets, democracy and religious tolerance.
http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-turkey-unrest-turkey-s-coup-is-broadcasting-live-on-1468628296-htmlstory.html

Turkey’s Leaders Say Coup Attempt Foiled as Clashes Rock Nation
Turkey’s leaders said they have largely quelled an attempted military coup, after army officers claimed to have seized power in the country. Clashes persisted in major cities as tanks blockaded roads, soldiers fought with police and warplanes bombed the parliament in Ankara. ...

Prime Minister Binali Yildirim said the situation was largely under the control, and top military leaders who weren’t involved in the uprising condemned it. Turkey’s NATO allies declared their support for the elected government. ...

But clashes persisted around military headquarters in Ankara, while massive explosions continued to rock the capital -- where the legislature was hit by at least two airstrikes -- and Istanbul.
“The coup attempt in Turkey seems backed by only a faction in the Turkish military and is unlikely to succeed,” said Jorge Benitez, a senior fellow at the Brent Scowcroft Center on International Security in Washington. “The rest of the Turkish military, plus the intelligence services will keep Erdogan in power.”

The U.S. backed Erdogan and his government. The Obama administration has “absolute support” for the elected government of Turkey, its NATO ally, Secretary of State John Kerry said in an e-mailed statement.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-07-15/turkish-premier-says-elements-of-army-attempt-to-seize-power

The overall general analysis is that the coup was initiated by junior officers in the military, without top brass. They did it as a protest against Erdogan's increasing islamicisation of Turkey (versus secular).

My opinion -- European and US governments have screwed up, long term. They should have stepped in about Erdogan YEARS ago. LONG TERM.. a more and more fundy muslim Turkey would be bad for Europe.
And Erdogan overall, is a loose cannon in NATO.

And he's been helping ISIS all this time, because he wants to defeat Assad. But then that's screwed up this whole effort in the West to defeat ISIS, all along.
It's some real byzantine stuff (pun intended) going on, over there, in the middle east and syria conflict and the power bloc struggle between shia Iran and then Assad and the sunni nations.

Overall -- what Erdogan is doing, dragging Turkey more and more fundamentalist islam and away from western secularism, isn't good for Europe.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Sixstrings » Fri 15 Jul 2016, 22:43:55

This was a couple weeks ago:



The Latest: Pence with Trump on blocking some immigration
Indiana Gov. Mike Pence says he supports Donald Trump's call to "temporarily suspend immigration from countries where terrorists' influence and impact represents a threat to the United States."
http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-07-15/the-latest-trump-said-to-offer-ind-governor-spot-on-ticket


I'm not sure anymore, seems like that would maybe be a "good idea," folks. :|
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby M_B_S » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 01:02:52

The question is:

What is better for US or EUROPE ?


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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 05:32:23

I lost my bet, coup fail. Bummer.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby dissident » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 09:08:19

This "coup" was more than likely engineered by Erdo-turd's regime to enable a further consolidation of his dictatorship. It is just too convenient for him. He even gets to look like a hero of the people.

Hoodwinking a few soldiers is easily done with a few regime plants who pose as dissidents. There can even be serious fighting and a few dozen victims. But the main thing is that there is zero chance for the rebels to succeed.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-07-1 ... s-hundreds

Hundreds of soldiers but thousands of judges? Really now.
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Re: MILITARY COUP IN TURKEY

Unread postby Newfie » Sat 16 Jul 2016, 09:15:32

Yeah, it's a gift to the regieme. He will consolidate power and it will give him cover for further purges. Not good.
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