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Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Fri 24 Feb 2017, 16:11:25

Hope your semi retirement from PO is suiting you well Dohboi haha. Don't worry I am keeping the trolls at bay
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby pstarr » Fri 24 Feb 2017, 16:34:11

This is all so weird. As much as I distrust KJ's partisan sniping and his crazy Singularity, he makes good arguments on GW.

My evolving personal truth is that global greening is real, and peak oil trumps it all . . . GW, KJ, Trump,industrial civilization, emmissions, and us lol
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby KaiserJeep » Fri 24 Feb 2017, 22:23:33

So go live in the redwoods .... in a net zero energy home, off the grid. If you don't fancy hoofing it, get even more solar panels and an EV.

Then do not care about the price of oil. The world is what you make it. TANSTAAFL.
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 02 Mar 2017, 16:05:42

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/cli ... a129ea4ea2
Another indication of connections already manifesting between climate change and migration
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Fri 31 Mar 2017, 15:39:46

http://newscenter.lbl.gov/2017/03/09/so ... n-climate/
Study: Soils Could Release Much More Carbon Than Expected as Climate Warms
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby dissident » Fri 31 Mar 2017, 21:17:40

onlooker wrote:http://newscenter.lbl.gov/2017/03/09/soils-carbon-climate/
Study: Soils Could Release Much More Carbon Than Expected as Climate Warms


We'll be adapting our agriculture at our pleasure according to the deniers and the delayers. This BS delusion is being drilled into people's heads from different angles, not just news media. The Expanse TV series is dishing out the BS that even as the oceans change chemical regime, unbounded numbers of humans will just keep on living. No, they will die by the billion. The human obsession of being exceptional to the rest of reality is grotesque. We are nothing but an aspect of reality and cannot will our survival if the we destroy the conditions necessary for survival.
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby sjn » Sat 01 Apr 2017, 05:08:56

dissident wrote:
onlooker wrote:http://newscenter.lbl.gov/2017/03/09/soils-carbon-climate/
Study: Soils Could Release Much More Carbon Than Expected as Climate Warms


We'll be adapting our agriculture at our pleasure according to the deniers and the delayers. This BS delusion is being drilled into people's heads from different angles, not just news media. The Expanse TV series is dishing out the BS that even as the oceans change chemical regime, unbounded numbers of humans will just keep on living. No, they will die by the billion. The human obsession of being exceptional to the rest of reality is grotesque. We are nothing but an aspect of reality and cannot will our survival if the we destroy the conditions necessary for survival.

I thought the same when I saw the show. In the latest episode they admit simplified ecosystems such as those artificially constructed on asteroids or moon bases are extremely fragile and prone to cascade failure and collapse, yet the process of radically simplifying the Earths ecosystem has no effect on the ability of the planet to sustain billions of humans?
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 01 Apr 2017, 06:39:38

Plus it cannot be overstated how important the climate system is to all bio-chemical processes on this planet and indeed all planets and by extension whether and what type of life will exist on a given planet
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby dohboi » Sun 02 Apr 2017, 03:31:18

254 reported dead so far in Colombian mud slides; hundreds missing

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/04/h ... 25068.html

...torrential rains triggered severe flooding and mudslides...30 percent of monthly rain fell in just one night...
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Thu 13 Apr 2017, 16:44:32

Science has already predicted when we will leave our former climate behind. Somewhere between 2033 and 2070, nothing will be the same in a hotter world.


http://www.ecoshock.org/2017/04/the-tim ... rture.html
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby Cid_Yama » Fri 14 Apr 2017, 02:26:29

I've got news for them, we have already left our former climate behind. Just ask Plant.

My favorite ice fishing spot no longer freezes over in the winter. They used to have the Shantytown Festival with Ice shantys as far as the eye could see. Now it's open water year round.
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Fri 14 Apr 2017, 03:44:24

Cid_Yama wrote:I've got news for them, we have already left our former climate behind. Just ask Plant.

My favorite ice fishing spot no longer freezes over in the winter. They used to have the Shantytown Festival with Ice shantys as far as the eye could see. Now it's open water year round.

From just what us happening in the Arctic, we are already leaving our former climate behind 8O
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Sun 16 Apr 2017, 17:23:39

Missed the record by 2 degrees here in NY. Right now 81F
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby dohboi » Mon 17 Apr 2017, 08:15:10

40 dead as massive floods hit Iran

https://www.rt.com/news/384918-iran-dea ... aftermath/
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby vox_mundi » Mon 17 Apr 2017, 10:25:59

Someone's channeled Cid ...

Early warnings of an out-of-control climate

Image

Global warming is edging perilously close to out-of-control, according to a growing number of scientific reports from round the planet, a leading science writer has warned.

"Time is running out if we want to preserve our world in a stable, healthy and productive state, capable of feeding and supporting us all," says Julian Cribb, author of Surviving the 21st Century, a book on the ten greatest challenges facing humanity and what we can do about them.

"The great concern is the rapid rise, over the last three years, in methane levels in the atmosphere. Methane is a gas with 28 times the planet-heating power of carbon dioxide. Scientists estimate there may be as much as 5 trillion tonnes of it locked in permafrost and seabed deposits.

"There is mounting evidence that, as the planet warms due to human activity, these vast reserves of greenhouse gas are now starting to melt and vent naturally. The Earth's past history shows this could unleash runaway global warming, driving up planetary temperatures by as much as 9 or 10 degrees Celsius.

"At such temperatures, some scientists consider there is a high risk the planet would become uninhabitable to humans and large animals,"
Mr Cribb says.

... Mr Cribb says that so far humans have released about 2 billion tonnes of CO2, which has warmed the planet by one degree C. By 2040, we will release another billion tonnes and push the planet's temperature up by 2 degrees or more.

"This we can possibly control, by cutting back on our use of fossil fuels and by ceasing to burn coal," he says. "However, there is no way to stop the methane venting naturally from the seabed and permafrost once it starts – and there are potentially 5 trillion tonnes of it.

Mr Cribb said that technical difficulty in measuring the Earth's natural methane emissions and estimating the size of its reserves has until now led to the gas being discounted, or downplayed, in warnings about dangerous climate change by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change and other agencies.

"That time is over. We are now witnessing early warning signs of major methane release. If it gets out of control, there will be nothing humans can do to prevent the planet overheating quite rapidly."

Surviving the 21st Century (Springer International 2017) is a powerful new book exploring the main risks facing humanity: ecological collapse, resource depletion, weapons of mass destruction, climate change, global poisoning, food crises, population and urban overexpansion, pandemic disease, dangerous new technologies and self-delusion – and what can and should be done to limit them.
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby jedrider » Tue 18 Apr 2017, 10:25:43

This is the hardest reality to discuss, Stiles said, and a reason flood insurance is serving as a kind of advance scout into a more difficult future. “When you go out to the end of the century, some of these neighborhoods don’t exist, so it’s hard to get community engagement,” he said. “Nobody wants to talk beyond where the dragons are on the map, into uncharted territory.


https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/18/magazine/when-rising-seas-transform-risk-into-certainty.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=photo-spot-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0

A realistic assessment in the New York Times.
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby pstarr » Tue 18 Apr 2017, 11:24:26

so we have climate chaos? It seems we have always had climate chaos. We here in California just endured a decade of climate chaos: a great historic drought followed by a great historic deluge. And everything around me is green and happy. Does anyone pretend to know when the next episode of climate chaos will wash across this great state?
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby Tanada » Wed 19 Apr 2017, 08:38:54

pstarr wrote:so we have climate chaos? It seems we have always had climate chaos. We here in California just endured a decade of climate chaos: a great historic drought followed by a great historic deluge. And everything around me is green and happy. Does anyone pretend to know when the next episode of climate chaos will wash across this great state?


My biggest issue with this thread is that most people confuse WEATHER with CLIMATE. Until you have a 30 to 50 year average you do not have climate. Do you really think climate in 2017 is chaotic compared to 1986? Or even a stronger case, more chaotic than 1966? Remember you are not comparing two years, you are comparing the 30-50 year average from 30 to 50 years ago with the 30-50 year average as seen THIS YEAR.

Weather has been pretty sporadic the last 5-10 years, but I fondly recall the 1970's when the weather was pretty unusual as well. A year or a decade of unusual weather is interesting, but it is not climate.
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Wed 19 Apr 2017, 09:33:10

What your saying is true T. However utilizing your 30 to 50 year average, we can discern radical changes to in fact the climate system. We also have records to establish conditions much further back in time. Using the Arctic as a case study, we have both current physical observances and measurements which can be compared to several decades back. We also have the Geophysical records from ice cores etc. to gauge the degree of change which has been occurring over longer time spans. So that the anomalous situation of an Ice free Arctic Sea has been determined to not have existed for at least 2.6 million years. A condition which seems to be on the cusp of occurring now. http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense ... exist.html . So climate does seem to be changing
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Re: Climate Chaos Is Here Pt. 3

Unread postby dohboi » Wed 19 Apr 2017, 14:42:28

As a gardener, all I have to look at is the change in hardiness zones to know that climate is fundamentally shifting on the planet.

But of course, besides ol's excellent point, there are many indications that things are shifting in fundamental ways. Every weather event now has been affected by these fundamental shifts, so they are all relevant here, imho.

And if you want a study, here's one from just a couple years ago:

Extreme weather already on increase due to climate change


Extreme heatwaves and heavy rain storms are already happening with increasing regularity worldwide because of manmade climate change, according to new research.

Global warming over the last century means heat extremes that previously only occurred once every 1,000 days are happening four to five times more often...

...one in five extreme rain events experienced globally are a result of the 0.85C global rise in temperatre since the Industrial Revolution...


Here's a link to the original scholarly article in Nature:

https://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal ... e2617.html
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