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Carrying Capacity/Human Overshoot; Pt. 3, 21st century perspecti

Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Sat 10 Jan 2015, 20:58:15

The bigger question is how much of everything combustible that humans have access to will we end up burning before equilibrium is reached. The bets vary from not much more to every barrel, every gas pocket, every tree, then everybody. We are specialists in burning shit. Then finding more to burn. All our fancy crap can mostly be summarised as a fancy way of burning more shit. Will humanity evolve, bottleneck & keep being shit burners, or literally burn up our environment remains to be seen. Check your nightly news for approximations.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Sat 10 Jan 2015, 21:04:03

onlooker wrote:then what happens when the wood runs out?

We can never truly run out of wood because wood is a renewable resource.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Sat 10 Jan 2015, 22:10:32

Well that would assume replanting and that rate of use does not exceed rate of renewal! Water is also renewal so is topsoil yet we are busy depleting both. I think what must be understood is that with the huge population we have we are depleting renewable resources because we are extracting or using them faster then they are or can be being replenished, so that renewing cannot keep up with extraction or use.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Sat 10 Jan 2015, 22:52:36

onlooker wrote:Well that would assume replanting and that rate of use does not exceed rate of renewal! Water is also renewal so is topsoil yet we are busy depleting both. I think what must be understood is that with the huge population we have we are depleting renewable resources because we are extracting or using them faster then they are or can be being replenished, so that renewing cannot keep up with extraction or use.

But we can always replant trees. At least trees are renewable unlike oil and coal.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Sun 11 Jan 2015, 00:04:50

careinke wrote:
vtsnowedin wrote: :mrgreen: Your numbers are bogus. Average forest in the middle latitudes can only support one cord per acre per year sustainably.



You should probably own and live in a forest before challenging what can and cannot be done.
[/quote] I own seventy acres of forest in Vermont and have been cutting firewood and saw logs off it for forty years. 8)
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby Newfie » Sun 11 Jan 2015, 00:57:49

DesuMaiden wrote:
onlooker wrote:then what happens when the wood runs out?

We can never truly run out of wood because wood is a renewable resource.


Easter Island

Lebanon

Haiti

Etc.

But we now have the wood vs. coal thread you started. So why not take it there?
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby careinke » Sun 11 Jan 2015, 01:23:37

DesuMaiden wrote:So is there enough wood for us to rely solely on wood instead of coal?


I seriously doubt that unless some dramatic lifestyle changes take place.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 14:34:25

Newfie wrote:
DesuMaiden wrote:
onlooker wrote:then what happens when the wood runs out?

We can never truly run out of wood because wood is a renewable resource.


Easter Island

Lebanon

Haiti

Etc.

But we now have the wood vs. coal thread you started. So why not take it there?

But that's only if we over use the wood. If we manage our wood resource properly, we can never run out of wood.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby Newfie » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 15:13:33

We already HAVE over used the wood. We have NOT managed our wood or any other resource properly.

You are a young fellow, what you se out your window is what you consider "Norman." And that In itself is normal.

I'm an old fart, what I see outsid my window looks nothing like what I grew up with. I can see the abnormality.

My Father was very aware of this and took pains for me to understands. So, to some degree, I see the world through is 1930 eyes.

It is frightening.

Then wood I buy today is crap compared t the wood I bought as a kid, and that was crap compared to what my Dad bought. I recently had some 2x4's I could not drive a 8 penny nail into, they would split, badly.

To get an older viewpoint read old books. Or someone who has studied the history.

Come to America, drive from NYC to Chicago. When you look out the window remember that this was ALL old growth forests, 6 or more feet in diameter, that we clear cut, with hand saws. 14 or so hours of it. At 60mph. All gone. Let that seep in. That it was all gone in the mid 1800's. BEFORE the population bloom.

Read a history of venice.

Read Sea of Slaughter.

Read, read, read.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 16:13:08

So let's go back to the main discussion of this thread. Why is it blasphemous to state that there are simply too many people on this planet? There are too many people on this planet who are consuming too much resources, too quickly, in an economy that only knows how to grow. This planet's biosphere is dying. There are 150 species becoming extinct every day. 50,000 per year becoming extinct on this planet. We are living in the middle of the 6th great extinction, which is comparable to the extinction that wiped out the dinosaurs. We are the cause of this extinction, because there are 7 billion humans on this planet using up all of the resources that would otherwise be used up by the other species on this planet. The other species on this planet get none of those resources and land because all 7 billion of us are using them. And therefore the other species become extinct. You have to be in serious denial that our planet is overpopulated with humans. And you must be even dumber to believe that infinite growth in consumption and population is possible on a finite planet. But that's what we are pursing. Infinite growth collides with finite energy and resources resulting in a catastrophic outcome.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 16:45:08

DesuMaiden wrote:So let's go back to the main discussion of this thread. Why is it blasphemous to state that there are simply too many people on this planet? There are too many people on this planet who are consuming too much resources, too quickly, in an economy that only knows how to grow. This planet's biosphere is dying. There are 150 species becoming extinct every day. 50,000 per year becoming extinct on this planet. We are living in the middle of the 6th great extinction, which is comparable to the extinction that wiped out the dinosaurs. We are the cause of this extinction, because there are 7 billion humans on this planet using up all of the resources that would otherwise be used up by the other species on this planet. The other species on this planet get none of those resources and land because all 7 billion of us are using them. And therefore the other species become extinct. You have to be in serious denial that our planet is overpopulated with humans. And you must be even dumber to believe that infinite growth in consumption and population is possible on a finite planet. But that's what we are pursing. Infinite growth collides with finite energy and resources resulting in a catastrophic outcome.

A reasonable appraisal of the situation. Now what do you want to do about it?
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 16:59:48

vtsnowedin wrote:
DesuMaiden wrote:So let's go back to the main discussion of this thread. Why is it blasphemous to state that there are simply too many people on this planet? There are too many people on this planet who are consuming too much resources, too quickly, in an economy that only knows how to grow. This planet's biosphere is dying. There are 150 species becoming extinct every day. 50,000 per year becoming extinct on this planet. We are living in the middle of the 6th great extinction, which is comparable to the extinction that wiped out the dinosaurs. We are the cause of this extinction, because there are 7 billion humans on this planet using up all of the resources that would otherwise be used up by the other species on this planet. The other species on this planet get none of those resources and land because all 7 billion of us are using them. And therefore the other species become extinct. You have to be in serious denial that our planet is overpopulated with humans. And you must be even dumber to believe that infinite growth in consumption and population is possible on a finite planet. But that's what we are pursing. Infinite growth collides with finite energy and resources resulting in a catastrophic outcome.

A reasonable appraisal of the situation. Now what do you want to do about it?

The solution is simple, but probably impossible to do in real life. It is to enact a one-child policy for the entire planet. Everyone follows the one-child policy of China. And by doing this, we can gradually reduce the world population back down to a sustainable level.

That's the best solution in the long-term, but realistically it can't be done because of stupid religious reasons. Again, religion is the cause of the problem. According to Christianity and Islam, we need to be as fruitful as possible, multiply and subdue the Earth(Genesis 1:18). So the fact that these people are reproducing like there is no tomorrow is just following their religion. This is why I think Christianity and Islam need to be tossed in the trash can immediately. These religions promote infinite growth in consumption and population. Of course, infinite growth is impossible, which is why the impossible goals proposed by these religions need to be tossed in the trash can immediately.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 18:03:52

A one child policy is not good enough/soon enough considering population momentum and where we are today. Some over populated countries need to go to a no-child policy for five to ten years just to stop the collapse from starting at their door.
The two great religions Christan and Islam will most likely go to war against each other both feeling that god gives them the mandate to exterminate the other. The radical Islamist of ISIS seem to already have come to that conclusion. They may find that once they have sufficiently alarmed the Christians that they have awakened a sleeping tiger.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 18:35:20

Islam is far from a United force, so is Christianity. It appears the game at present is to get Sunni & Shia hatred to cause implosion of Islam as a threat to secular Christendom or Israel.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby vtsnowedin » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 19:40:51

SeaGypsy wrote:Islam is far from a United force, so is Christianity. It appears the game at present is to get Sunni & Shia hatred to cause implosion of Islam as a threat to secular Christendom or Israel.

True enough but let one or two of these radical extremist score a major strike on the order of 911 and the rest of the world will get united in a hurry. The truly peaceful Muslims will need to turn out the radicals or have all their members marked for extermination.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 20:05:31

vtsnowedin wrote:
SeaGypsy wrote:Islam is far from a United force, so is Christianity. It appears the game at present is to get Sunni & Shia hatred to cause implosion of Islam as a threat to secular Christendom or Israel.

True enough but let one or two of these radical extremist score a major strike on the order of 911 and the rest of the world will get united in a hurry. The truly peaceful Muslims will need to turn out the radicals or have all their members marked for extermination.

That is if you actually buy the mainstream media's story of 911 being a terrorist attack perpetuated by Islamic extremists. I believe it was an inside job done by the USA.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 20:22:03

So do I in fact there is a good site that stores of wealth of info that quite convincingly demonstrates US had a hand in 9-11. It is 911truth.org. But anyway to stay on topic, one way or the other 20 or 30 or 40 years from now all of this background noise will be over and we will either have turned the corner to create a sustainable world or we will be relegated to the dustbin of cosmic history. :shock: :shock: :shock:
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby ennui2 » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 21:15:02

DesuMaiden wrote:That is if you actually buy the mainstream media's story of 911 being a terrorist attack perpetuated by Islamic extremists. I believe it was an inside job done by the USA.


If there's one thing you can count on this site for, it is 911 troothers.

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I take it you're still waiting on Obama's birth certificate too?
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby DesuMaiden » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 21:20:43

ennui2 wrote:
DesuMaiden wrote:That is if you actually buy the mainstream media's story of 911 being a terrorist attack perpetuated by Islamic extremists. I believe it was an inside job done by the USA.


If there's one thing you can count on this site for, it is 911 troothers.

Image

I take it you're still waiting on Obama's birth certificate too?

Dude it has become increasingly obvious that 911 was an inside job.
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Re: Why is overpopulation such a taboo topic? Pt. 3

Unread postby onlooker » Mon 12 Jan 2015, 21:30:03

You got that right, again I do not argue this topic with anyone cause it is a polarizing topic, I just refer them to that site. 911truth.org. If they still refuse to acknowledge US involvement then they are just kidding themselves.
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