Which of the following methods of population control would you support assuming that they could be implemented ?
progressive taxation of families by the number of children
18%
[ 11 ]
forced contraception beyond a certain number of children
0%
[ 0 ]
progressive reduction of rights by the number of children (voting rights, medicare, pension, other retirement benefits)
1%
[ 1 ]
forced sterilization after a certain number of children
16%
[ 10 ]
all of the above
23%
[ 14 ]
none of the above
30%
[ 18 ]
some but not all of the above
10%
[ 6 ]
Total Votes : 60
Author
Message
IslandCrow Intermediate Crude
Joined: Sep 12, 2005 Posts: 775 Location: Finland
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:40 am Post subject: Re: population control options
While we are linked globally, one of the ideas that we need to get our heads around is how things are going to become local. Population rise/density is one of these.
I am well aware of world wide population statistics and the total growth, but this varies massively from area to area. We need to look at the local situation to find what controls if any are needed. We are arguing about a 'one-size-fits-all' solution, where we must start thinking on a more local level.
USA is way down the list with a population rise of only 0,6% (mid 2006-mid 2007). But what can we do about those at the top of the list? Eg.
Niger 3,4%
Mali 3,3%
East Timor 3,3%
Yemen 3,2%
Uganda 3,1%
Liberia 3,1%
Guinea-Bissau 3,1%
Chad 3,1%
Senegal 3,0%
Eritrea 3,0%
Dem.Rep. of Congo 3,0%
Burundi 3,0%
Burkina Faso 3,0%
Benin 3,0%
Somalia 2,9%
Palestinian Territory 2,9%
......
Maybe the debate should be about what the USA is going to do the the 1,8+ million extra people that it is adding to its population each year. Here in Europe we have different dynamics, such as in many places the population is in decline, or only growing through immigration.
Think globally act locally
[/end of rant] _________________ We should teach our children the 4-Rs: Reduce, Reuse, Recycle and Rejoice.
Joined: Sep 24, 2007 Posts: 2584 Location: third from the sun
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:36 am Post subject: Re: population control options
IslandCrow wrote:
I am well aware of world wide population statistics and the total growth, but this varies massively from area to area. We need to look at the local situation to find what controls if any are needed. We are arguing about a 'one-size-fits-all' solution, where we must start thinking on a more local level.
USA is way down the list with a population rise of only 0,6% (mid 2006-mid 2007). But what can we do about those at the top of the list? Eg.
Niger 3,4%
......
The problem with your argument is that the ecological footprint of the average citizen of a rich nation is MUCH larger than that of a citizen in a poor nation.
Reducing the population of the latter, even massively, would not solve the problem and any double standard would be viewed as politically unacceptable.
Btu _________________ only the paranoid survive
Last edited by btu2012 on Sat Sep 29, 2007 4:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:04 am Post subject: Re: population control options
btu2012 wrote:
The problem with your argument is that the ecological footprint of the average citizen of a rich nation is MUCH larger than that of a citizen in a poor nation.
Once FF are less and less available and consumerist lifestyle is "defeated" by default, those ecological footprints will be comparable (unless we return to open colonialism).
Quote:
Reducing the population of the latter, even massively, would
not solve the problem and any double standard would be viewed as politically unacceptable.
Reducing by design population of the former will not be politically acceptable either...
Anyway population of the former (say EU or Japan) is currently reducing (and US increase is largely due to immigration from Mexico) and population on the latter is increasing...
Joined: Apr 06, 2006 Posts: 2959 Location: 3 miles NW of Champoeg, Republic of Cascadia
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:44 am Post subject: Re: population control options
btu2012 wrote:
Here is a question for you. Do you think that a couple in Somalia who keeps having children in that hell of a place just because they don't care about contraception or because they want more hands to work their land actually cares what happens to those children after they are born ? Would you say that they love children just because they make lots of them ? Or perhaps they like unprotected sex, consequences be damned ?
Sam Kinison wrote:
You want to help world hunger? Stop sending them food. Don't send them another bite, send them U-Hauls. Send them a guy that says, "You know, we've been coming here giving you food for about 35 years now and we were driving through the desert, and we realized there wouldn't BE world hunger if you people would live where the FOOD IS! YOU LIVE IN A DESERT!! UNDERSTAND THAT? YOU LIVE IN A farking DESERT!! NOTHING GROWS HERE! NOTHING'S GONNA GROW HERE! Come here, you see this? This is sand. You know what it's gonna be 100 years from now? IT'S GONNA BE SAND!! YOU LIVE IN A farking DESERT! We have deserts in America, we just don't live in them, assholes!"
You should publish, Jack, you've a way with words. "Jack's Little Instruction Book."
5 grand to have the tubes tied? Fark that, give 'em an iPhone. You think I jest? _________________ Cogito, ergo non satis bibivi
I'm just gonna find a cash machine.
Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 602 Location: Atlanta, GA
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:08 pm Post subject: Re: population control options
EnergyUnlimited wrote:
truecougarblue wrote:
How about mandatory death penalty for any person convicted of a violent crime who also is proven to have a gang affiliation?
Another possibilty would be free heroin for all takers.
Those ideas are in general workable albeit you would have to start hanging peoples for parking offense to make a visible dent on population.
Free heroin for addicts - I think they have it in Switzerland.
About the heroin, I heard about that too...their line of thinking goes like this...let the addicts do their thing out in the open, so everyone else can see how horrible the stuff really is, thereby scaring any potential users from ever trying the stuff in the first place.
As for making a sizable dent in the population, it's really going to take a super flu or some other deadly pandemic that takes out a lot of people in a single go. Even better, a pandemic that would make 90% of child bearing age women infertile worldwide.
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 2:03 pm Post subject: Re: population control options
I agree that for population control those ideas have their shortcomings, but think of the quality of life improvement for those of us who aren't violent gang bangers.
Plus don't you recall the story about the inner city math teacher that tried to give a test in terms his kids would understand? I believe one of the questions was:
Hector has knocked up 87.5% of the b!tches in his gang. If his gang has 32 b!tches, how many has Hector knocked up?
If Hector meets his end sooner, rather than later, how many fewer teen pregnancies will we see in his territory?
Joined: Jun 13, 2007 Posts: 3354 Location: Minniesotuh
Posted: Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:20 pm Post subject: Re: population control options
Thinking (babbling) out loud:
Could there be a possible choice, if something was mandated (fat chance) by TPTB, of allowing one healthy child per family... for awhile.. before or after a 'die-off"...
The only reason I think of this is because I am wondering what damage would be done to the human gene pool...
Joined: Mar 09, 2007 Posts: 219 Location: No. Calif.
Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 11:42 am Post subject: Re: population control options
I favor methods of more traditiional warrior societies where dying for one's tribe is an honor. Maybe we should bring back dueling and sacrifice. No kidding! Any suggestions for the first sacrifices to be offered -- I have some good ones myself?? ''
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 12024 Location: zombie horde wonderland
Posted: Sat Sep 29, 2007 3:30 pm Post subject: Re: population control options
What about one of the methods used by the Tikopian islanders - suicidal ocean voyages? Make your mark on history - die a hero!
But more seriously - free contraception on demand. Free vasectomies. Free tubal ligations. Tons of free family planning info, maybe door-to-door family planning help, counseling.
Paid for by the community for the good of the community. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow..." - jboogy
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