New Passat Bluemotion II. 57.4 mpg US

VMarcHart · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 5:34 am

3aidlillahi wrote:

...we can combat that problem with new investments (like trillions of dollars) in a massive freight rail system which is electrified, thus boosting efficiency even greater.

Call this guys. They have loads of money. StrategeryCapital Management LLC

Otherwise you can also combat that problem with a little demand destruction. Food for thought.

MarkJ · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 485

Quote:

Yes, I know the EU mileage rates skew high, but real world is still likely to be in the upper 40s, so sign me up.

More Euro Diesel Hype. The Euro Test Cycle substantially inflates the fuel economy numbers. The Toyota Prius is rated @ 4.3L/100km (54.7 MPG) Combined in the Euro Test cycle.

With 50-Sate Legal U.S. Emissions, this would likely be rated in the low to mid 30s City and low to mid 40s Highway. With our large current regional gas/diesel price differential, a gas powered hybrid would be much cheaper to operate, especially if you did a lot of city driving.

biofuel13 · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 8:37 am

wisconsin_cur wrote:

Why did you take it to the dealer?
:roll:

Before you nominate me for "Upper Class Twit of the Year"-- I did go to several parts stores in town and got the same answer from all of them...Only the dealership carries the kind of headlights my car has.

Oh well.

I just hope that Volkswagon will think about their corporate name with this new Passat. If they truly make the "People's Car" then replacement parts should be inexpensive and easy to install by the owner. Just because a vehicle is technologically advanced does not mean that it has to be too complex for the average J12P to fix.

yesplease · **Joined:** Tue Oct 03, 2006 12:00 am **Posts:** 3654

MarkJ wrote:

More Euro Diesel Hype. The Euro Test Cycle substantially inflates the fuel economy numbers. The Toyota Prius is rated @ 4.3L/100km (54.7 MPG) Combined in the Euro Test cycle.

The Euro test cycle is very city heavy. something like 3/4s of the cycle is simulated city at an average speed of ~12mph, so the Prius would likely benefit quite a bit from that. A conventional car otoh, probably would end up hurting a bit more on the Euro test cycle, so I imagine the difference between U.S. and Euro mileage for this model isn't as big as it is with the Prius.

MarkJ wrote:

With 50-Sate Legal U.S. Emissions, this would likely be rated in the low to mid 30s City and low to mid 40s Highway. With our large current regional gas/diesel price differential, a gas powered hybrid would be much cheaper to operate, especially if you did a lot of city driving.

It already does, Euro VI has a lower NOx cap than T2B5 IIRC.

Quote:

With a common rail diesel engine that uses SCR after-treatment to the meet the 2013 EURO VI emissions standard

WatchfulEye · **Joined:** Thu Jun 07, 2007 12:00 am **Posts:** 55

biofuel13 wrote:

FOR THE LOVE OF GOD-- Don't ever buy a VW!!
450 Farking dollars for a headlight?!!??

That's about standard price for one of the new High Intensity Discharge (HID) headlights.

Bulbs are about $50. However, that's only part of the system. The real money is in the electronic ballast that generates the high voltages that the bulb needs (30,000 volts to ignite, and about 80 volts to run). A good quality ballast can cost over $200.

If you've got to replace the ballast, then it's a whole load of dissasembly to get at it.

And, unlike conventional headlights which come in standard sizes, HID lights may be designed specifically for that model of car, meaning that only dealers may be able to identify and supply the appropriate part.

MarkJ · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 485

yesplease wrote:

MarkJ wrote:

More Euro Diesel Hype. The Euro Test Cycle substantially inflates the fuel economy numbers. The Toyota Prius is rated @ 4.3L/100km (54.7 MPG) Combined in the Euro Test cycle.

The Euro test cycle is very city heavy. something like 3/4s of the cycle is simulated city at an average speed of ~12mph, so the Prius would likely benefit quite a bit from that. A conventional car otoh, probably would end up hurting a bit more on the Euro test cycle, so I imagine the difference between U.S. and Euro mileage for this model isn't as big as it is with the Prius.

Their Urban Test Cycle Rates The Toyota Prius at a more realistic 5.0L/100km (47 MPG).

Quote:

Urban cycle
The urban test cycle is carried out in a laboratory at an ambient temperature of 20°C to 30°C on a rolling road from a cold start, i.e. the engine has not run for several hours. The cycle consists of a series of accelerations, steady speeds, decelerations and idling. Maximum speed is 31 mph (50 km/h), average speed 12 mph (19 km/h) and the distance covered is 2.5 miles (4 km). The cycle is shown as Part One in the diagram below.

Extra-urban cycle
This cycle is conducted immediately following the urban cycle and consists of roughly half steady-speed driving and the remainder accelerations, decelerations, and some idling. Maximum speed is 75 mph (120 km/h), average speed is 39 mph (63 km/h) and the distance covered is 4.3 miles (7 km). The cycle is shown as Part Two in the diagram below.

Combined Fuel Consumption Figure
The combined figure presented is for the urban and the extra-urban cycle together. It is therefore an average of the two parts of the test, weighted by the distances covered in each part.

EPA Federal Test Procedure

Here's a classic example of Euro Diesel Hype

2009 Jetta BlueTDI Comes to US This Summer, Sports 60 MPG and Cleaner Emissions

The EPA rates the 2009 Jetta TDI @ 29/40 (Automatic) 30/41 (Six Speed Manual)

In This Review they're averaging 7.4L/100km (31.7 MPG) Overall.

Quote:

The all-important number here is its fuel consumption average. Well, in our hands, the TDI is averaging 7.4 L/100 km, which is pretty good considering we didn't do much highway mileage. We seriously doubt you'll rack up 1,100 km on a single tank like VW is claiming (which is basically the 55-litre tank averaging 4.8 L/100 km), but if you've got a light right foot, you'll get close to a thousand kilometres for every tankful.

eastbay · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 11:15 am

I wish they could get the price down a bit. With $5,000 down, it's still about $500/mo for 48 months after freight, taxes, licensing, and a few options.

VW used to be the place to go for those on limited budgets. No more.

vision-master · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 12:18 pm

Quote:

The EPA rates the 2009 Jetta TDI @ 29/40 (Automatic) 30/41 (Six Speed Manual)

Big fricken deal.

I get OVER 30 mpg highway (Auto) with my full-sized Monte Carlo SS.

SteinarN · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 12:24 pm

MarkJ wrote:

EPA Federal Test Procedure

Here's a classic example of Euro Diesel Hype

2009 Jetta BlueTDI Comes to US This Summer, Sports 60 MPG and Cleaner Emissions

The EPA rates the 2009 Jetta TDI @ 29/40 (Automatic) 30/41 (Six Speed Manual)

In This Review they're averaging 7.4L/100km (31.7 MPG) Overall.

Well, interesting link to EPA federal test procedure.

I could'n find the -09 Jetta, but I found the -06 Jetta among other with diesel engines. It shows the mileage both with the new and the old test procedure. But even more interesting is it that they apparently has a number of everydays test drivers reporting their actual fuel consumption. For the -06 Jetta with diesel engine it is 60 drivers/cars reporting their actual fuel consumption/mileage.

-06 Jetta 1.9L diesel combined:
New test: 33 mpg.
Old: 38 mpg.
Actual: 42.3 mpg average.
The actual test drivers range between 34 and 55 mpg.

Jetta mpg EPA and actual

SteinarN · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 12:37 pm

And here is the -05 Passat with the 2L common rail diesel.

New test, old test, actual:
27, 31, 37 mpg.

-05 Passat 2.0L Diesel mpg

VMarcHart · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 1:56 pm

vision-master wrote:

Quote:

The EPA rates the 2009 Jetta TDI @ 29/40 (Automatic) 30/41 (Six Speed Manual)

I get OVER 30 mpg highway (Auto) with my full-sized Monte Carlo SS.

I too get over 30mpg on the highway with my 6-cylinder. However, 33% higher efficiency is a decent jump.

mos6507 · **Posted:** Sat Oct 04, 2008 4:09 pm

SteinarN wrote:

When destilling crude oil only a small fraction is gasoline and a larger fraction is diesel and an even larger fraction is heavier molecules than diesel. To make the current needed amount of gasoline it is necessarry do "crack" the higher molecular weight molecules into smaller as in gasoline. As the available crude oil is getting ever more heavy more cracking is necessarry to produce the same amount of gasoline. So in order to make more diesel it is not necessarry to make gasoline in the first place, just to reconfigure the crackers to crack the heavy crude oil into a bit less light molecules like diesel instead of the very light gasoline molecules.

Good point. I also think there is a future for HCCI, which is a way to get all the efficiency benefits of diesel while burning regular gasoline.

MarkJ · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 485

vision-master wrote:

Quote:

The EPA rates the 2009 Jetta TDI @ 29/40 (Automatic) 30/41 (Six Speed Manual)

Big fricken deal.

I get OVER 30 mpg highway (Auto) with my full-sized Monte Carlo SS.

My LS1 powered Trans Am gets pretty decent highway mileage as well, plus it has plenty of horsepower and it's fun to drive. The car only cost me some salvaged materials and 5 days of labor.

MarkJ · **Joined:** Tue Mar 25, 2008 12:00 am **Posts:** 485

SteinarN wrote:

Well, interesting link to EPA federal test procedure.

I could'n find the -09 Jetta, but I found the -06 Jetta among other with diesel engines. It shows the mileage both with the new and the old test procedure. But even more interesting is it that they apparently has a number of everydays test drivers reporting their actual fuel consumption. For the -06 Jetta with diesel engine it is 60 drivers/cars reporting their actual fuel consumption/mileage.

-06 Jetta 1.9L diesel combined:
New test: 33 mpg.
Old: 38 mpg.
Actual: 42.3 mpg average.
The actual test drivers range between 34 and 55 mpg.

Jetta mpg EPA and actual

You can Search by Make @ the Fuel Economy Gov site.

Here's the 2009 Volkswagen listing.

The problem with user reported numbers is they're not scientific/accurate/confirmed and include numbers posted by conservative drivers, hyper-milers and people with a particular bias or motivation.

SteinarN · **Posted:** Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:19 am

Ok, I see some people argue we (US) should continue driving large cars with large V8 or V6 petrol engines and automatic transmission.

I understand you argue that those cars is as fuel efficient as we can make any car and people arguing there is way more fuel efficient, decent sized cars is plain wrong :roll:

New Passat Bluemotion II. 57.4 mpg US

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