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Eli
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Post subject: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 6:32 am |
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4029 Location: In a van down by the river
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Quote: ``It's surprising how fast GM is selling off the family silver,'' said Graeme Maxton, a director of the Economist Intelligence Unit in Hong Kong. ``It rings alarm bells.'' GM is selling it's assets at half there value. And they may have to cover pensions at Delphi which is about to declare bankruptcy. Quote: GM's largest parts supplier, Delphi, may declare bankruptcy this week, the New York Times reported today. The parts maker is asking GM, its former parent, for $6 billion in aid, people familiar with the situation said earlier last week.
And they are selling all there good assets to Toyota.
GM Sells Entire Stake in Fuji Heavy to Toyota, Market
I heard a guy the other day on bloomberg talking about what the auto industry needed to do to stay profitable and he spit out the same old stuff. He said they need to cut costs move production to cheaper markets like China and reduce their pension exposure.
So if you or some one you know needs a Job you better look in the Shanghai Daily Star.
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denverdave
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 2:02 pm |
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Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 83
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I saw something a while back about fuji heavy and toyota partnering up to produce hybrid subies. FHI doesn't sell enough cars to justify developing the technology from scratch, and are are sensible enough not to use GM's hybrid technology, and they can offer improved batteries to toyota.
_________________ 'If a ruler hearkens to lies, all his officials become wicked.'
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Eli
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 2:31 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4029 Location: In a van down by the river
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Yeah thinking about it long term it is a real win for Toyota.
Weren't all theses guys just saying we would make more Hybrids but we can't get the parts?
So now GM sells the stake they had in a company that could have given them hybrid parts. Damn the torpedoes let make more trucks.
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Tanada
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:08 pm |
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Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4771 Location: West shore Lake Eire, MI, USA
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Eli wrote: Yeah thinking about it long term it is a real win for Toyota.
Weren't all theses guys just saying we would make more Hybrids but we can't get the parts?
So now GM sells the stake they had in a company that could have given them hybrid parts. Damn the torpedoes let make more trucks.
If I owned a controlling interest in GM I would start out by ending all Hummer production with 11/01/05 and lay off all workers in the hummer division, reduce all pick up production by 50% and cut the work force to a level appropriate for that production level, disband the whole fuel cell/hydrogen economy division, eliminate the Pontiac and Buick lines of production because they duplicate production in other divisions needlessly.
After that I would take stock of what was selling and what wasn't and trim more come 1Q 2006.
_________________ Always appeal to a man's enlightened self interest, you can trust him to look out for himself honestly, It's when you appeal to his Honor or the Common Good that he stops paying attention.
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emersonbiggins
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 7:40 pm |
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 5316 Location: Dallas
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Tanada wrote: Eli wrote: Yeah thinking about it long term it is a real win for Toyota.
Weren't all theses guys just saying we would make more Hybrids but we can't get the parts?
So now GM sells the stake they had in a company that could have given them hybrid parts. Damn the torpedoes let make more trucks. If I owned a controlling interest in GM I would start out by ending all Hummer production with 11/01/05 and lay off all workers in the hummer division, reduce all pick up production by 50% and cut the work force to a level appropriate for that production level, disband the whole fuel cell/hydrogen economy division, eliminate the Pontiac and Buick lines of production because they duplicate production in other divisions needlessly. After that I would take stock of what was selling and what wasn't and trim more come 1Q 2006.
If I owned a controlling interest in GM, I would buy up Bombardier in Canada and co-op with them to rebuild America's rail system (which, of course, my company helped destroy). Bombardier would provide the trainsets and engines, and GM would provide all the support vehicles for the endeavor. I would, as above, eliminate Hummer, Pontiac and Buick. I would also eliminate GMC and Saturn. Cadillac too. Oh, and Chevrolet as well. I would sell Saab back to the Swedes. Basically, I'd be getting out of the business that has no future.
Maybe I'd buy Marin or Gary Fisher and get into the bike business.
Then I'll strap on my golden parachute and stick the taxpayers with my pension costs. Hey, it's the American™ way! 
_________________ "It's called the American Dream because you'd have to be asleep to believe it."
George Carlin
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Eli
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:35 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4029 Location: In a van down by the river
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Well If I! owned contorting interest in Gm I would...
sell all my stock tomorrow buy some land in Idaho, put up razor wire and guard towers manned by beautiful hot, but deadly, chicks and stock up on enough food and beer to last a life time.
And I would say tough nuts to all you Peak Oil doomer loosers because I would be rich biatch!
Seeing as I do not own controlling interest in GM let me just say you guys here at PO are like family to me *group huge* 
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jaws
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:43 pm |
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Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 1256
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If I owned a controlling interest in GM I would sell it to Toyota.
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emersonbiggins
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:43 pm |
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 5316 Location: Dallas
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Eli wrote: Well If I! owned contorting interest in Gm I would... sell all my stock tomorrow buy some land in Idaho, put up razor wire and guard towers manned by beautiful hot, but deadly, chicks and stock up on enough food and beer to last a life time. And I would say tough nuts to all you Peak Oil doomer loosers because I would be rich biatch! Seeing as I do not own controlling interest in GM let me just say you guys here at PO are like family to me *group huge* 
I dig the hot, but deadly chicks. Too bad it will be illegal to make an S+M movie with any of them, tho.
Jesus, I had to stretch for that thread reference. *' FBI Porn Squad' wink, wink*
_________________ "It's called the American Dream because you'd have to be asleep to believe it."
George Carlin
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jdmartin
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2005 9:45 pm |
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Joined: Thu May 19, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 999 Location: Merry Ol' USA
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Tanada wrote: Eli wrote: Yeah thinking about it long term it is a real win for Toyota.
Weren't all theses guys just saying we would make more Hybrids but we can't get the parts?
So now GM sells the stake they had in a company that could have given them hybrid parts. Damn the torpedoes let make more trucks. If I owned a controlling interest in GM I would start out by ending all Hummer production with 11/01/05 and lay off all workers in the hummer division, reduce all pick up production by 50% and cut the work force to a level appropriate for that production level, disband the whole fuel cell/hydrogen economy division, eliminate the Pontiac and Buick lines of production because they duplicate production in other divisions needlessly. After that I would take stock of what was selling and what wasn't and trim more come 1Q 2006.
Good ideas except for the pickup part, which is the only arena GM/Chevrolet have any brand loyalty left. Today's car owners choose Chevy because they're cheap and/or all they can afford. Otherwise, if you had the same 25k to spend, would you buy an Impala or an Accord? Easy choice for my money. Even with the gas prices there is still a good market for trucks. Where the market is tanked is with the SUV, which really wasn't all that great for anything that other segments couldn't already do anyway (minivan, hatchback, etc). Even 4wd has been coopted by most cars as all-wheel drive. That was really the original strength of the SUV (Bronco, Blazer, Cherokee, etc) - a 4wd vehicle that was small for those who didn't need a truck. They just ballooned into the fat pigs they've become.
_________________ After fueling up their cars, Twyman says they bowed their heads and asked God for cheaper gas.There was no immediate answer, but he says other motorists joined in and the service station owner didn't run them off.
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Waterthrush
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 3:49 am |
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| Heavy Crude |
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Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 231 Location: New Jersey
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I've saved a couple of pronouncements by GM in the past year where "we must be very careful to look at the realities" which is defined as them as an "updated" (whatever that means) line of SUVs. They have repeated this over and over again.
It angers me that there isn't one American carmaker making a hybrid passenger car at the moment, ten years after the technology came on board. Ford's hybrid SUV is emblematic of what is wrong here. That's the only hybrid model - and it's an SUV. 15 models of SUVs and not one hybrid. Idiots.
The first manufacturer (and it will be Asian) to bring the price of a hybrid down to that of a regular car wins big.
Al Gore called the end of the dominance of the internal combustion engine for 2017. He was ridiculed. But he was right.
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Eli
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 5:57 am |
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4029 Location: In a van down by the river
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Waterrush
That is the saddest thing that here these guys are with all this market research money available and the big plan they have to increase their bottom line is more SUVs?
Really they deserve to go under for being such idiots, but its too bad they are going to take all those people who work for them down with them.
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aahala
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 8:09 am |
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Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 1:00 am Posts: 954
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GM is selling off their assets at 50% of value because of their new
"Prebankruptcy Discount for Everyone plan."
How long the plan will stay in effect is unknown but it's rumored it will
soon be replaced by the "Bankruptcy Discount for Everyone plan." 
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Tanada
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:37 pm |
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Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4771 Location: West shore Lake Eire, MI, USA
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Eli wrote: Well If I! owned contorting interest in Gm I would... sell all my stock tomorrow buy some land in Idaho, put up razor wire and guard towers manned by beautiful hot, but deadly, chicks and stock up on enough food and beer to last a life time. And I would say tough nuts to all you Peak Oil doomer loosers because I would be rich biatch! Seeing as I do not own controlling interest in GM let me just say you guys here at PO are like family to me *group huge* 
Well uhmm, OKAY!
But really, my simple point was, GM could be doing a lot to save itself, but it isn't. I have concluded this means that the execs fully expect the FEDS to save there bacon with massive tax incentives, low interest loans and down right payoff's because they have a large workfoirce who would vote angry in 2006 if they loose their jobs.
_________________ Always appeal to a man's enlightened self interest, you can trust him to look out for himself honestly, It's when you appeal to his Honor or the Common Good that he stops paying attention.
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rogerhb
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 6:50 pm |
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Joined: Mon Sep 06, 2004 12:00 am Posts: 5313 Location: Smalltown New Zealand
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Frank O'Donnell wrote: More than half a century ago, then-General Motors President Charles Wilson was misquoted as having said, “What’s good for General Motors is good for the country.” That quote came to epitomize the auto giant’s arrogance.
So what did Charles Wilson really say?
_________________ "Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers." - Henry Louis Mencken
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Eli
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Post subject: Re: Gm going under fast Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2005 7:38 pm |
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Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 12:00 am Posts: 4029 Location: In a van down by the river
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Tanda
I think you maybe right about GM.
They are selling everything they can to raise cash knowing full well they are going to declare bankruptcy.
But Tanda the fact is they were in very bad shape even before high oil and now they are just sinking faster.
They should have moved into the small crossover SUV thing 5 years ago, now they are too late. Their problem now is they have no money and are in desperate need for more just to pay for what they have right now.
But now with high oil prices they need to transform 85 percent of their vehicle line up which would cost them cash they do not have. They are so very screwed.
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