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Page added on September 12, 2017

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Shell’s defence of big oil is too hopeful

Business

Royal Dutch Shell, looking deeply into its crystal ball, sees a future that’s still heavily dependent on oil. The Anglo-Dutch giant expects crude will continue to play a major role in global energy supply for decades, even in its less oil-friendly scenario. That optimism goes someway to justifying the billions of dollars it continues to invest in exploiting new reserves and expanding its fuel network. But it’s also a view that may place too much faith in the combustion engine – and China staying with its current strategy.

Despite growing evidence that the oil era is grinding to an ugly and disruptive halt, Shell remains optimistic. On Sept. 8, the company updated its two core strategic models – labeled Mountains and Oceans – which both come to similar conclusions about the future of crude and liquid hydrocarbon fuels. Although peak demand will happen sometime after 2030, and governments will keep intervening to cut carbon emissions, oil could still account for more than a fifth of all energy even by 2060.

This matters to Shell investors. Its $50 billion takeover of BG Group in January 2016 made it the largest shipper of gas amongst its peers. However, oil remains core to its profitability. If oil has a future, it makes sense for Shell to keep investing in it.

The problem is that Shell’s projections could easily be proven wrong. China’s state news agency Xinhua has reported that Beijing is studying banning cars running on fossil fuels in the future – following similar policies in France and the United Kingdom. That will in turn embolden manufacturers of electric vehicles to intensify their efforts to produce cheaper and longer range alternatives. The car has enriched oil companies like Shell and their shareholders for over a century – its demise may be theirs too.

– Royal Dutch Shell has updated its forecasts for global energy consumption and production through to 2060.

– The Anglo-Dutch company said on Sept. 8 that it foresees oil playing a significant role in global energy supply through to 2060 and doesn’t anticipate a peak in demand coming before 2030, despite the growth in electric vehicle sales.

– China has begun studying banning the manufacture and sale of cars running on conventional fossil fuels, the official Xinhua news agency reported on Sept. 10. The world’s second largest oil consuming nation is expected to make up for weakening demand in developed nations, which are focusing on reducing hydrocarbons usage to head off climate change.

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FT article



83 Comments on "Shell’s defence of big oil is too hopeful"

  1. baha on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 6:52 am 

    My projections are as good as theirs. All the oil company and EIA projections have been wrong for as long as I have been paying attention.

    Who knows what the future will bring…only those who are pushing it.

    But you got to love the drama. So many things will change in the next 10 years 🙂

  2. Davy on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 7:16 am 

    “All the oil company and EIA projections have been wrong.”
    All is a very strong word that sounds more emotional than reality.

  3. fmr-paultard on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 8:19 am 

    the tide is high but i’m holding on,
    i’m gonna be your number 1
    numba 1

    the whole conservatard arguement starts out like a blondie song. this is passed on as intellectual discourse

  4. fmr-paultard on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 8:19 am 

    i’m gonna be your number 1

    my original hymen

  5. rockman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 9:39 am 

    Davy – What we have is the continued confusion between Big Oil, such as Shell Oil or ExxonMobil, and the petroleum industry. Today Big Oil represents X% of the market share. As depletion grinds away (as well as canibalism of the weak by the stronger like Shell) of Little Oil it’s very easy to anticipatethe that the Shell et al will eventually control more the X% of the market…perhaps considerably more.

    Yes: eventually the world will be producing less then 94 million bopd…considerably less at one point. And depending on growth of alt energy continued high demand for fossil fuels that will increase prices…perhaps at significantly higher prices. At that’s the future Shell is preparing for.

    Like the old joke about a bear chasing you and a ftiend: it doesn’t matter how fast the bear runs…it’s how fast your friend runs that’s critical. Same with Shell, ExxonMobil et al: it doesn’t matter how fast depletion is hurting the “petroleum industry”. What matters is how fast Little Oil depletes that’s critical.

    Much of this Big Oil “is f*cked” comes from the hated of those companies that provides these same pissed off consumers with the fossil fuels they demand to preserve their lifestyles.

  6. Sissyfuss on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 10:31 am 

    Might I interest anyone in purchasing a new computer designed buggy whip?

  7. GregT on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 10:58 am 

    “Despite growing evidence that the oil era is grinding to an ugly and disruptive halt”

    Speculation is not evidence.

  8. rockman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 11:17 am 

    Greg – True. Especially when using loaded phrases as “grinding to a halt” during a time when global oil production has increased to record high levels. Yes: over the coming DECADES global oil producing will decline. But “grinding to a halt”? Not anytime soon even by the most pessimistic AND realistic expectation.

  9. Antius on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 11:49 am 

    Where does this assumption that we are approaching peak demand actually come from? Oil is an energy source and demand for energy grows in proportion with economic output on a global basis. More economic growth means more energy demand which equals more oil demand. That is the pattern we have seen so far.

    Of course, oil is a transport fuel. People might assume that oil demand could peak because humans will shun it as a transport fuel in favour of other fuels, principally electric vehicles. In spite of some rather silly statements made by European governments, I see little prospect of that either. Electric cars have inferior performance compared to conventional IC cars and are much more expensive to buy. They would be nothing more than curiosities for wealthy green-tech enthusiasts were it not for big subsidies applied to them. In the car industry the popular joke was: “If you can afford the battery, we will throw in the car for free!” Of course, there are no serious plans to replace oil as a fuel for haulage, aircraft or ships. So far, the battery electric vehicle concept has only been applied to automobiles.

    Or could it mean that conventional oil production declines, is replaced by expensive non-conventional sources (shale, etc.) which human beings can no longer afford in such large amounts. That I can believe, especially when you consider that wages are a falling part of GDP and income inequality is increasing. The financial crisis of 2007/08 was basically caused by people defaulting on debts because they could no longer afford to pay them and live. Is this what ‘peak demand’ looks like?

  10. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 11:50 am 

    50 New 100% Electric Car Models By 2025 From Volkswagen Group!

    https://cleantechnica.com/2017/09/12/50-new-100-electric-car-models-2025-volkswagen-group/

    But remember folks (repeat after me):

    – We are doomed
    – We are all toast
    – We are all going to die (which is true regardless)
    – renewable energy is an extension of the fossil fuel system
    – e-vehicles are fake
    – We will be driving gasoline cars until kingdom comes

  11. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:10 pm 

    According to VW itself they plan 80, not 50 e-models by 2025.

    My apologies.

    https://www.volkswagenag.com/en/news/2017/09/Roadmap_E.html

  12. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:10 pm 

    “– e-vehicles are fake”? Who said that?

    clog, I’m confused. Can you explain for me how e-cars and wind turbines and solar panels, none of which I think are fake, can reverse the laws of physics?

    Do you know what a positive self reinforcing feed back loop is? Human behaviour has triggered dozens of them and they are all but unstoppable unless the humans are willing to spend many trillions sucking CO2 out of the atmosphere and sequestering it and massively halting land abuse and implementing massive tree planting scheme and a handful of other things that would have beneficial effects.

    ok clog, let’s here how e-cars is gonna save the humans.

  13. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:14 pm 

    Germans clog

    North Sea warming twice as fast as world’s oceans

    The average temperature of the North Sea has risen twice as fast as the oceans of the world. The changes are likely to alter the ecosystem and endanger indigenous fish such as cod.

    http://www.dw.com/en/north-sea-warming-twice-as-fast-as-worlds-oceans/a-40427339

    Warming oceans are great…if you’re a hurricane. Harvey & Irma were Super Sized. They’re babies compared to what is coming.

  14. Antius on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:18 pm 

    Here’s the problem, Clog. We have had battery electric vehicles for as long as we have had IC cars – 120 years, give or take. In that time, they have always suffered from inferior performance (range, speed, etc.) and higher cost than conventional IC cars. Every now and then, new models come out that look snazzy and cool and a select group of millionaires buy a few of them. But the population at large cannot afford them and why would they want a car with inferior performance anyhow?

    Unless there is a big change in basic technology (which I admit is always possible) or a very large reduction in cost (or both) it is difficult to foresee that an increasingly cash strapped population are going to opt for these things. More likely, when the depression hits, they won’t be able to afford any car at all. Quite a lot of young people in Europe and the US are already in that position.

  15. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:20 pm 

    North Sea warming twice as fast as world’s oceans

    Great! Gone is the necessity to have to travel to Spain or Greece for your beach holiday! Lowers my footprint.

    The Dutch coast can be so beautiful.

    http://tinyurl.com/y9ws2as2

    So I will end my life as I started it:

    http://siagrius.be/siagrius/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/SiagriusStrand1.jpg

  16. Outcast_Searcher on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:29 pm 

    Baha, is an imperfect forecast for oil “wrong”? Oil demand has been increasing every year in recent decades, aside from 2009.

    Green energy is coming — but in a world where the number of cars is increasing rapidly as third world population continues to do the same — the insane forecasts are the ones which claim that by 2030, the oil era is going to be “halted”.

    Best case for green energy, there will still be a TREMENDOUS number of ICE vehicles (including hybrids) on the road in 2030. Also, there will still be a tremendous demand for oil for chemicals, plastics, etc. for a long time to come — at least as far as we can see with current technology.

    I still think the more moderate forecasts look the most realistic. (Neither in the super-green nor denier camp, and acknowledging the sheer scale and cost of the transition).

  17. Outcast_Searcher on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 12:39 pm 

    Cloggie,the other 30 are PHEV’s. So by 2025, VW claims they’ll have 50 pure EV’s, 30 PHEV’s, and whatever ICE’s aren’t replaced.

    If all goes as planned. Remember that VW may not have any choice. For me, they’re totally screwed as far as me being a customer for an ICE vehicle, given their dieselgate fraud.

    For EV’s, I’d consider them, if there is a lack of other convenient, reliable choices.

    Until I see the overwhelming S-curve of EV adoption of Tony Seba solidly materialize (and remember, he assumes fully autonomous and cheap cars ramping up rapidly by 2021 as a base assumption — one FAR from assured), I still think that the moderate forecasts for EV adoption that acknowledge the scale of the problem and third world growth (and finances and electricity supply/reliability) are the most realistic.

  18. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 1:03 pm 

    Clog, Canadians know about the Dutch coast from when they liberated your people from the Nazi yoke and saved y’all from famine. Ended the ‘Hongerwinter ‘. I doubt you would have survived otherwise.

    Was the liberation of the Netherlands the Canadian Army’s most important achievement in the Second World War?

    “J.L. GRANATSTEIN
    NO

    Liberating the Netherlands was the most important political achievement of the Canadian Army in the Second World War, but it was not the most important military accomplishment.”

    “ANDREW IAROCCI
    YES

    Every step of the Canadian Army’s long march through Italy, Normandy and Northwest Europe helped to win the Second World War. Among these campaigns, however, the liberation of the Netherlands stands out as the army’s most significant achievement.”

    https://legionmagazine.com/en/2015/05/face-to-face-was-the-liberation-of-the-netherlands-the-canadian-armys-most-important-achievement-in-the-second-world-war/

    What say you clog? I’m guessing yes, since if they did not kick that Nazi ass back then, you would not be here now. No need to thank me clog, I wasn’t there and, unlike you, I do not try and ride the coattails of long dead people.

  19. Anonymouse1 on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 1:50 pm 

    cloggy-stain, repeat after me

    -the only fake here, is you, cloggen-fraud
    -you are a faux-pseudo ‘green’, one that cant stop talking about wind turbines, yet denies AGW as a valid observation.
    -you are doomed to make a fool of yourself quote articles which seldom support your fraudulent, whimsical fantasies.
    -you constantly assert you have intimate knowledge of the motivations, and goals of people you have never met, or ever will. Often, world leaders or other noteables.
    -you are a fake anti-globalist
    -you will continue your boring, disjointed proselytizing(which is true regardless).
    -gasoline cars will continue to haul you back and forth to your mental-health sessions.

  20. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 3:13 pm 

    Well, well, well, I can’t believe my luck. Yet again does the TalmudTurk pretend not to understand what really happened in 1945, although I have explained it to him many times and he never ever challenged my explanation.

    Davy same thing. Standard shtick: I explain in detail what happened. Davy doesn’t respond as he in his own words has “moved on” and when it suits him he will insert again and again that the ZOG-serfs, I mean the Americans, “saved our European asses”.

    Canadians know about the Dutch coast from when they liberated your people from the Nazi yoke and saved y’all from famine. Ended the ‘Hongerwinter ‘.

    No you didn’t, what really happened was that Canadian ZOG-serfs put us under the US yoke with the consequence that the Netherlands (and the rest of western Europe) is en route towards demographic destruction, but not nearly as much as North-America itself, a crucial advantage for Europe.

    For that reason I prefer Nazis over Americans any time of the day (better independent of course).

    Why did the Germans invade the Netherlands on May 10, 1940? This is a forbidden question to ask in the Netherlands, just like it is a forbidden question to ask in the US why the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor. Because the real answers to these question would expose the lies the West, the last stinking communist shit pile, is based upon.

    So what did happen? Why did the Germans invade Holland. Because the Dutch government basically asked for it. How come?

    Timeline:

    September 1, 1940 – Germans invaded Poland to intervene and protect their countrymen against ethnic cleansing by the Poles.
    September 3, 1940 – As a consequence of the Was Guarantee, the British and French were forced to declare war on Germany. The Americans and this Jew in particular…

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuVLsdyQfIk

    …had forced the British and French into this war guarantee for no other purpose than to ensure that the war would be started, to the advantage of the Americans as confirmed by Chamberlain:

    https://nationalvanguard.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/The-Forrestal-Diaries-excerpt.jpg

    Interestingly for full 8 months nothing happens between Britain, France and Germany.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoney_War

    What does that mean? That neither the British and French, nor the Germans really wanted that war. The only ones who wanted that war were the Americans and their puppet Churchill, totally in the pay of the Jews.

    https://www.amazon.com/Churchill-Jews-Friendship-Martin-Gilbert-ebook/dp/B009OZN68A/ref=sr_1_1

    It was Churchill who hated that nothing happened and no shot was fired and it was him who started to push for the war to get started.
    This stinking warmonger and hero of the neocohns began to exert pressure on the governments of Norway and Holland to abandon neutrality. British war preparation began in Norway. Neither the British nor the French were keen on waging a war on their own (French territory), so the decided to attack German interests abroad, to start with in Norway and make a resource war out of it.

    https://postimg.org/image/l52u2q0rn/

    [part 1]

  21. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 3:14 pm 

    In January 1940 the agitation began and beginning of April the mining of Norwegian harbors began. Purpose: cut off iron ore supply via Narvik to Germany. Had they succeeded Germany would have lost the war immediately. Hitler in contrast had no intention whatsoever to occupy Norway. But when Germans spies got wind of the immanent invasion of Norway by the French and British, Berlin understood that they had to react otherweise they were toast. On April 9 1940 the Germans raced through Denmark and arrived in Norway on the very same day French and British troops arrived.

    The stinking lying encyclopedia of the NWO, I mean (((wikipedia))), claims:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Weser%C3%BCbung

    In the early morning of 9 April 1940 (Wesertag; “Weser Day”), Germany invaded Denmark and Norway, ostensibly as a preventive manoeuvre against a planned, and openly discussed, Franco-British occupation of Norway. After the invasions, envoys of the Germans informed the governments of Denmark and Norway that the Wehrmacht had come to protect the countries’ neutrality against Franco-British aggression.

    This was entirely in line with the truth. Germans, French and British troops arrived on the same day and after a month of fighting, 25,000 British and French were chased out of Norway by 8,000 Germans, as was to be expected.

    It is hilarious that this book, written by a Norwegian military man, who had a career in the US military, began to study the subject and discovered that the Alllied story was one pack of lies and that in reality it were the British and French and not the Germans who had sought war (read: blocking iron ore transport to Germany):

    https://www.amazon.com/Hitlers-Preemptive-War-Battle-Norway-ebook/dp/B004HW6AEW/ref=sr_1_1

    So the Alllies got their assess kicked in Norway, good for them.

    Next they turned to Holland and here is where WW2 really began and I am not proud in having to admit it.

    Our PM Colijn was ordered to London ca March 20, 1940, where he met Churchill, Chamberlain, Halifax and others…

    https://postimg.org/image/akjjckpwt/

    …and was put under great pressure to abandon neutrality. Colijn got week knees and caved in, the sucker. Thanks to him we got WW2 really started and 5 years of (deserved) occupation.
    How do we know? Because of this:

    [part 2]

  22. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 3:15 pm 

    https://gerard1945.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/07b.jpg

    Well, well, well, a top secret document from the French High Command, stating that the French intended to invade Germany via Holland. The document says that advancing French troops would have access to Dutch fuel in return for vouchers. Here you have proof that the Anglo-French advance via Belgium and the Netherlands would happen in agreement with the Colijn government. Holland had abandoned neutrality. The Jew Lou de Jong, who after the war was asked by the Dutch government to write the history of WW2 (always a bad idea to let be done by a Jew, but hey, after 1945 we were a ZOG-colony)… even he had to admit, 25 years later, that Holland “had not been so neutral after all” and that top military brass had contacts with the British:

    https://postimg.org/image/o3qj91dpl/

    And again the Germans found out well in advance. When the Germans invaded the Netherlands on May 10, 1945, they did that because the hundreds of thousands of British and French troops stationed in France had began to march Northwards, with the intention to cross through Belgium and Holland in order to attack the vital German industrial Ruhr-area. The Germans invaded in the early morning. ” Surprisingly” the French invaded a few hours later in the Zeeland province. The official lie is that the French came to the aide of the Dutch, but the reality is that the French intended to move through the Netherlands to attack Germany, but were preempted by the Germans. Even the NYT had to publish the explanation by the German FM von Ribbentrop:

    https://postimg.org/image/oxqfj4a87/

    And as always the Germans spoke the truth and lying Alllied bitches… well lied after the war.

    The Germans, to their horror, now that they were directly attacked, new the could not avoid war. Within six weeks time the had kicked the British back over the Channel , where they belong, and the French defeated.

    And what the Germans do next?

    Offer peace:

    https://postimg.org/image/pxqqs7169/

    (July 19, 1940)

    What he says is: let us please stop this war, it is madness.

    But Churchill had become PM and his (((masters))) wanted nothing less than complete German defeat, so that they could take over Europe, together with their Stalin pall.

    [part 3]

  23. Cloggie on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 3:17 pm 

    https://www.amazon.com/Dear-Mr-Stalin-Correspondence-Roosevelt/dp/0300108540/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_1

    Once you know the full truth it is difficult not to vomit over the enormous pack of Alllied self-serving lies.

    But now, in 2017, the tide of history has changed. The US is not very far away from a civil war where the stakes are very high: European America managing to break away from Washington vs Apneaman’s (((deep state))) ramming European America into submission.

    Once that conflict erupts enormous new opportunities arrise to interven and downsize the joints and return the 1945-“favor”.

    Thanks for the opportunity to rub in the truth once again.

    Keep it coming, Talmudturd! LOL

    [part 4]

    End.

  24. Davy on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 3:21 pm 

    Clog, we are probably going to have to save your ass yet again so start eating crow to get used to the taste. I give you Eurotard 10 years and you will be fighting amongst yourselves yet again. Stupid really, maybe we should just let the Russians have you.

  25. fmr-paultard on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 4:00 pm 

    antard marilynn monrole first posed nude in 1947. full 10 years before the “60s” you alluded to. i’m perplexed and having difficulty looking for supporting information for your virgin bribes and plain janes and intact hymen

    perhaps you’re talking about india or some other places? in that case it’s common to look for a virgin bribe and have doctors check her virginity in the present day!

  26. fmr-paultard on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 4:02 pm 

    you probably be at ease hanging out with mother teresa. i’m against her. i’m all about women empowerment by having them doing the killing by joining the armed forces.

    http://www.azquotes.com/picture-quotes/quote-mt-mother-teresa-was-not-a-friend-of-the-poor-she-was-a-friend-of-poverty-she-said-that-christopher-hitchens-63-8-0857.jpg

  27. shortonoil on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 4:08 pm 

    “Oil demand has been increasing every year in recent decades, aside from 2009.”

    You state a determination with no numbers to back it up? Between 1960 and 2005 oil production increased at an average annual rate of 5.5%. Between 2005 and 2015 it increased by 0.75%. It is now growing at 14% of the rate that it had in the previous half century. Oil production growth has all but stopped! Since production must come before there can be demand, so also has demand. Oil production is now no longer growing fast enough to supply its own needed increased in supply to power its production. The author is correct; the oil age is ending!

  28. Sissyfuss on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 4:35 pm 

    I don’t know Cloggedinjectors. With Volkswagens track record when you open up the hood to inspect your new and amazing electric motor you find a hamster and a wire wheel.

  29. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 5:16 pm 

    Sissyfuss, you come up with some great on liners. Keep on keeping on bro.

  30. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 11:02 pm 

    Some people have different hopes for big Cancer.

    Stop talking right now about the threat of climate change. It’s here; it’s happening
    Bill McKibben

    Hurricane Harvey, Hurricane Irma, flash fires, droughts: all of them tell us one thing – we need to stand up to the fossil fuel industry and fast

    For the sake of keeping things manageable, let’s confine the discussion to a single continent and a single week: North America over the last seven days.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/sep/11/threat-climate-change-hurricane-harvey-irma-droughts

    A week of very costly shit kicking. There are going to many more and many worse. There will be no standing up to big Cancer, or at least it won’t have any effect as per usual. The Cancer apes just want to clean up the big fucking mess pretend it was a ‘one off’ and go back to spending their dopamine dollars on trivial consumer goodies and ‘services’. The Cancer industry will continue to suck as much black glucose out of the earth as they can. Dead apes walking.

  31. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 11:04 pm 

    Big Toxic.

    Texas: Harvey Triggered Spill of a Half-Million Gallons of Gasoline

    “The Center for Biological Diversity reports flooded oil refineries and chemical plants released as much as 5 million pounds of pollutants into the air during the storm.”

    https://www.democracynow.org/2017/9/12/headlines/texas_harvey_triggered_spill_of_a_half_million_gallons_of_gasoline

  32. Apneaman on Tue, 12th Sep 2017 11:12 pm 

    After Harvey, Texas Left With Toxic Soup of Sewage, Spilled Fuel, Pesticides, and More

    As hurricane cleanup continues, Times report reveals alarming levels of E. coli and heavy metals in Houston’s flooded neighborhoods

    “Following reports that refineries and petrochemical plants released millions of pounds of pollutants because of Hurricane Harvey, which battered Southeast Texas last month, test results published on Monday by the New York Times confirmed concerns that “Houston’s floodwaters are tainted with toxins.”

    https://www.commondreams.org/news/2017/09/12/after-harvey-texas-left-toxic-soup-sewage-spilled-fuel-pesticides-and-more

    “because of Hurricane Harvey”, “because of Hurricane Harvey”, “because of Hurricane Harvey”

    That line is in almost every article I’ve seen. Wrong. It’s because the humans are a cancer and the AGW jacked disasters are the earths immune system response. Had enough of the humans infecting and consuming and reproducing like humans. It’s like a war. Who gonna win? Hurricane Chemotherapy is what it is. Unlimited rounds of treatment until the Cancer is eradicated.

  33. Apneaman on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 12:37 am 

    The Great Flood

    “How many times will we rebuild Florida’s cities, Houston, coastal New Jersey, New Orleans and other population centers ravaged by storms lethally intensified by global warming? At what point, surveying the devastation and knowing more is inevitable, will we walk away, leaving behind vast coastal dead zones? Will we retreat even further into magical thinking to cope with the fury we have unleashed from the natural world?”

    https://www.truthdig.com/articles/the-great-flood/

    My money is on doubling down on denial and magical thinking.

  34. makati1 on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 12:39 am 

    I like your analogy, Ap. Hurricanes have been around a long time, but they are going to get more and more nasty as temps heat the oceans.

    Jose is still sitting about 1,000 miles off the coast, being held back by the remnants of Irma. When that ends, he may come ashore. We shall see.

  35. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 1:55 am 

    Clog, we are probably going to have to save your ass yet again so start eating crow to get used to the taste. I give you Eurotard 10 years and you will be fighting amongst yourselves yet again.

    Predictable again the juvenile “Eurotard” response from Davy and a deafening silence from his master the TalmudTurd. Neither has the means to refute what I have to say about how WW2 came about, where American gangsters instigated that drama. Both Apneaman and Davy are fundamentally dishonest.

    But that’s OK. Both kosher empires, the USSR and USA, will be the shortest lived in history. Davy is already preparing to save his sorry ass and flee to Italy to escape the coming civil war, as he will never fight for anything, he will just run.

    Stupid really, maybe we should just let the Russians have you.

    Sure Davy. The EU has a GDP (PPP/nominal) of $21T/$17T, against Russia $4T/$2T and a population of 500m against 140m (the US meanwhile has $18.5T/$18.5T and China $12T/$8T). Source Wikipedia. The EU has clearly overtaken the US and the distance will only increase in the coming years.

    #GoldenDecade

    Oh and the EU is spending more on defense than Russia. Realism was never your fort.

    Russia, that just kicked US ass in Syria, aspires to become accepted by Europe, which will happen after the downfall of #1 US vassal Murkel.

    Like everywhere else in Germany, it was yesterday again booing-time in Rosenheim und Augsburg:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXaRT_O1CSo
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4x3DRg9ga7c

    Doesn’t look good at all for US colony Germany, that will reject the US imposed multicult model ever stronger. Committing demographic suicide, that’s perhaps for America, not for Europe.

  36. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 2:05 am 

    “How many times will we rebuild Florida’s cities, Houston, coastal New Jersey, New Orleans and other population centers ravaged by storms lethally intensified by global warming?

    Until the US will understand that it will never conquer the entire world, trim the “defense” budget and get a proper dike in place. It’s not rocket science.

    Florida got away relatively lucky, now that Irma took a path along the West coast rather than the East coast. I saw damage estimates of $100B for Florida and $200B for Houston.

    You get a lot of dike and draining system for that money.

    Here an article from 2009 where a price tag is mentioned of $4B, peanuts compared to the damage inflicted by Harvey and Irma:

    http://tinyurl.com/y9z66kqq

    55-mile barrier, 17 feet high to protect Houston and Gulf area. Nothing happened of course, “policing the world” is more important. Now you have a price tag of 50 times higher, for Houston alone.

    But remember folks, you can always turn to your buddies in Holland. Nobody in the world builds dikes like they can.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBfTyMzRVdM

  37. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 2:15 am 

    Here a shorter version of the acquired expertise over the last century, that could come in useful for the SE-USA:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Z3REX6YnyE

  38. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 2:42 am 

    Shell is right in that oil and gas will continue to play a major role for decades to come.

    The problem is that Shell’s projections could easily be proven wrong. China’s state news agency Xinhua has reported that Beijing is studying banning cars running on fossil fuels in the future – following similar policies in France and the United Kingdom.

    Wrong. Shifting from oil (acquired from gasoline stations) to e-vehicles does NOT mean a shift away from oil. That only happens when electricity from oil, generated in power stations, will be replaced by renewable energy. That will take a little longer. It will be e-vehicles first and renewable energy transition next. In the meantime we will see pollution moving away from the cities towards the exhaust of power stations, which at least is progress for the inhabitants of China’s mega-cities.

    In all likelihood Europe will be the first major economy to achieve the energy transition by 2050, as China is still focused on lifting the economic level for its population as well.

  39. Antius on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 6:30 am 

    (Battery) electric vehicles require heavy subsidies to compete with ICE vehicles on a cost basis. The assumption that they will overrun the automobile market assumes that those subsidies continue and governments honour their pledges to ban ICEs.

    Ask yourselves how likely this is in a world gripped by recession, deficits and tightening budgets.

  40. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 6:33 am 

    e-mobility latest:

    Mercedes: 50 models by 2022
    Volkswagen: 50 models by 2025
    Volvo: new models only e-vehicles after 2019
    Tesla: more market value than GM or Ford, with only 1% of their sales.
    Norway: after 2025 only new e-vehicles allowed.

    Are Mercedes, Volkswagen, Volvo, Tesla and Norwegians fools, Antius?

  41. Davy on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 7:22 am 

    “It will be e-vehicles first and renewable energy transition next.”
    Ha, Ha, Ha, just like the first days of oil and later how it was going to be too cheap to meter NUK energy because we were aware oil is finite. Techno optimist are always betting on the come. Never ending fantasy futures is all I have seen from techno optimism. We are digging the whole deeper and deeper. I am not saying stop. We may have no choice because entropy is winning out over human intelligence and species development. It is now a matter of survival of a doomed species. We are destroying a planet in development and overpopulation and techno solutions are just making it worse.

    If we had true wisdom we would self-reflect and pause. We would likely say no to more and embrace less development and population. To get there we would take draconian measures across the board. But we are not wise and nor are we capable with our intelligence. Humans are an evolutionary dead end precisely because of intelligence and the inability to manage that powerful attribute.

  42. Boat on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 7:27 am 

    clog,

    “Russia, that just kicked US ass in Syria”,

    Really? The US has had a 500 troop limit for some time. I read Trump has given the ok for higher troop levels wherever the military wants them. Stay tuned.

    Germany sent 3 million when attacking Russia.

  43. Davy on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 7:36 am 

    “ Ask yourselves how likely this is in a world gripped by recession, deficits and tightening budgets.”

    Right Antius, in a different world without so many other predicaments besides energy, batteries might be a solution. If we had different behaviors and far few people in the world maybe we could do a renewable world. It will be the end of affluence that ends this budding renewable energy event. EV’s will likewise die on the vine when the economy craters. The problem with the economy is this time it might not come back. There are far too many issues now and the issues are global. They revolve around debt and malinvestment. So much of what was built out will not bring a proper return. This is a macro situation with entire economies poorly invested and underfunded. It was developmental waste and is useless to future survival. We invested poorly to remain affluent and we will soon pay a price. All the while depletion does not sleep, the planet degrades, and the social fabric tears. We are approaching a day of reckoning. This will likely be a process and location based but it will visit all of us sooner or later. If you are prosperous like everyone on this board is then enjoy because tough times are ahead and maybe a premature painful death.

  44. JuanP on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 7:48 am 

    The USA and its minions have successfully destroyed Syria. They didn’t get their preferred outcome which was a broken, submissive nation, but they taught the rest of the world the same lesson they have been teaching us since before I was born. You either submit to the USA or you get destroyed. Mission accomplished. Same as in Yugoslavia, Afghanistan, Iraq, Lybia, etc.

  45. Boat on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 8:01 am 

    Juan,

    Good to see you got through the storm. However your taxes bomb like most of the free world. Your just a minion like hundreds of millions of others.

  46. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 8:07 am 

    Really? The US has had a 500 troop limit for some time.

    The US kicked the USSR out of Afghanistan by supporting the Taliban and succeeded.

    The US wanted to repeat the stunt in Syria and instigated the civil war by supporting the “moderate rebels” and (initially) ISIS, until the latter proclaimed the “Caliphate”.

    They almost succeeded in toppling until the great European nation Russia intervened and turned the tide and brought Assad virtually to victory (minus Kurdistan).

    The US neocohns (your masters, who plan to destroy European America by beating them in minority status) failed in their objective, as formulated in the late nineties (PNAC, which led to inside job 9/11) like they failed in their objectives in Iraq and inadvertently handed over the country to the Iranian sphere of influence, free of charge.

    They even temporarily lost Egypt, until they supported the installation of a military dictatorship and brought the country back in US orbit.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if the US would lose KSA as well. And finally Europe.

    Germany sent 3 million when attacking Russia.

    Have you watched C-Span documentary already I pointed you to? Of course not, you insist to repeat the usual Nuremberg lies because they make you look good.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nj9Geqf3LB8

    Viktor Suvorov was a Soviet spy who fled to the West and spilled the beans on the true intentions of Stalin (of which Roosevelt and Churchill were well aware). The reason why Germany attacked first, was because the USSR in Mai 1941 was in a state of full mobilization and preparing for the assault against Germany and Europe. German intelligence detected the mobilization and decided not to wait and avoid the first blow by dealing the first blow themselves, in line btw with international law, which allows preemptive strikes. The Red Army had vastly outnumbered the Germans in troops and material. The lies you and your Soviet buddies concocted in Nuremberg was that “peaceloving USSR” was unexpectedly being assaulted by the Germans. It wasn’t. It was a preemptive attack, backed by international law. But parvenues like the USSR and USA could not care less about international law.

    But meanwhile it is 2017. Russia has become a normal European country and that leaves one final commie (=globalist) joint to be downsized. And that would be you, the greedy “benevolent hegemon” that wants it all, by any method and is meanwhile the most hated country on earth and is such will achieve nothing.

    Ha, Ha, Ha, just like the first days of oil and later how it was going to be too cheap to meter NUK energy because we were aware oil is finite. Techno optimist are always betting on the come. Never ending fantasy futures is all I have seen from techno optimism. We are digging the whole deeper and deeper. I am not saying stop.

    Everybody is betting on the “to come”, including you and your doomerism. Replacing fossil fuel capacity with renewable energy, that is to date only happening in Europe, because China still insists on 6+% growth rates. But at least it IS happening.

  47. Davy on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 8:16 am 

    “Everybody is betting on the “to come”, including you and your doomerism. Replacing fossil fuel capacity with renewable energy, that is to date only happening in Europe, because China still insists on 6+% growth rates. But at least it IS happening.”
    Sure clog but I am real and you are a fake. I honestly face the difficulties ahead and you dismiss them. BTW, your history revisions are a fraud that just justify and support your irrational white Eurotard racism and corresponding Anti-Americanism. You can’t stand the fact we saved your ass twice and will likely have to do it yet again in the future. I have no problem with you kicking out the non-Dutch element in your country. That is your business but don’t project your failures unto me. That is what whiners do. Wa wa

  48. Boat on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 8:56 am 

    Rohingya Muslim militants in Myanmar attacked killing 12 police and 59 Rohingya citizens dead. Myanmar soldiers responded with rape, arson, beatings and yet to counted killings. The UN estimates that some 313,000 refugees have fled to Bangladesh.
    The US/NATO looks quite weak for not acting in the same manner when clearing out rebels. You can’t win conflicts by showing humanity. Only the Russians and Assad can kill in Syria with impunity.
    Guys like mak, clog, and greggiet, which side will they pick in this fight.

    US, Russia, EU etc all seem to be supporting the Myanmar gov while the Muslim world becomes outraged. China bless her heart just wants peace with no real plan.

  49. Cloggie on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 9:18 am 

    Sure clog but I am real and you are a fake.

    Eh no, you are a compulsory liar, just like your master Apneaman. You will lie for anything as long as it makes your empire of mass murderers look good.

    BTW, your history revisions are a fraud

    But you are too stupid to refute them, eh, even if I spell it it out for you? You have “moved on”, eh.

    your irrational white Eurotard racism and corresponding Anti-Americanism.

    There is nothing irrational against defending your country becoming overrun with Muslims or Africans. You are a good commie Davy. George Soros will be proud of you. You have my blessing for swamping your own country with them. The sooner your empire blows itself up, the better.

    You can’t stand the fact we saved your ass twice and will likely have to do it yet again in the future.

    I have explained to you time and time again that WW1 was instigated by Britain and WW2 by the US and that Germany was cornered by that bunch of mass murderers in Washington that control you. But the dishonest coward that you are, you always avoid discussion, because you know very well that you have no arguments. I have unfortunately to conclude that you a deeply dishonest person. Greg and makati discovered that a long time ago but I have this pan-European agenda, so I had lots of patience with you. Patience I am currently running out of. I am afraid have to put you at the same league as boat and your common master Apneaman.

    A pity.

  50. Boat on Wed, 13th Sep 2017 9:28 am 

    clog,

    Really? The US has had a 500 troop limit for some time.

    The US was never at war with Syria. They trained and armed some Assad/ISIS haters but no real attacks on the Assad military or it’s infrastructure. Ok, 1 bombing run after a chemical incident.
    And no need to post links. In the past I found way to much opinion and trash. Some links were good with facts but I have no time to sort. Your links lost credibility.
    I do follow some of your energy links but even most of them are old news as I follow energy closely.

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